Battle Between The Sexes

[Shar]

Norman and ONE SG have kindly taken the time to introduce a program designed to increase health and stanima in women. Too many posts to bring over from the other board but I am sure the ones of us in here could benefit from either seeing this information for the first time...........OR being able to see it repeated. Especially for us "slow learners" .

I thought about splitting this into 2 parts
BATTLE OF THE SEXES....Mens division
BATTLE OF THE SEXES..Womens division
But, since women are said to be deficient in the art of direction *I meant they can't tell east from west* and men refuse to ask directions......I left the one title. This way, they talk, we listen. Good deal. I would say that is a positive maybe.

Joyous, I may should have split this as I am concerned even though I whispered to you, Norman or One may have heard. Their senses seemed to be sharpened with all the rest they have been getting lately. Then I realized, no worry, they didn't hear...EGOS are like big ear muffs
They muffle the sound of almost any voice.

WEll, I will just go to the dentist tommorrow, come home, lie down, eat chocolate covered cherries and the next day will check in here to see if the training session is still on track.

[norman]

This board should make it a lot easier for exchange of valuable information. Free but valuable just the same. It is nice to know several women actually understand the positive aspects of such an exchange. Others!!! well lets just say they would fail One's thumb test no matter how much time was granted.

Lucky for me I didn't see that part about gritting teeth and turning red otherwise I might think someone with the initials Shar wasn't taking this seriously. Snowden on the other hand seems to be doing much better since starting. Joyous & Tori are doing fairly well but backslide occasionally. To be expected I suppose.

A squirrel skin drum??? kind of small for women with big ambitions. Oh well you have to start somewhere. Maybe if some net research was done a walrus hide would be available on eBay. Think big, if you are going to be a drummer you will need several drums.

Why must we think of everything, ahhh I'm not complaining just tired from all the effort today of watching my wife weed the herb garden.

[norman]

I saw this in another topic by Shar and was sure some might not interpret it properly.


the better women look
the hotter it gets

Women need to watched carefully at all times, their words can be cryptic. It takes a man's keen mind to know what she meant. I won't offer an explanation because an explanation isn't needed; I know what "it" is and that is all that matters.

[Shar]

Ah Norman, it appears someone is unhappy because I received a bit of praise and is posting using my name. A devastating thing for an innocent such as I...I know it isn't seemly to protest but Gene says I may sit and write a note in my defense while the 20 cakes are baking. A project to raise money for the horse he wants to buy. I will bring the post over that Gene edited and allowed me to post to ONE in the other forum since it now pertains to you too. I do so hope you two will read it with kindness and rose colored glasses .
*****************************

ONE, mind you I am not pointing out that you could have made an error, but as a new phase 3 ..very avid, open to learning member, it must be obvious that someone is posting using my name.

In phase 3, I am only allowed to read instructions and reply in answer to a question or to ask one. AND that only if I am wanting to improve Gene's status in life. I do so hope you will consider my past demeanor and evaluate again. I believe JOyous recognized that as she has not posted in response to such an outrageous statement.

Oh, I finished the washboard today. I have pickle juice left over and Gene says I may send some to the other women with your and Norman's permission.

(I added this as Gene says we should be a little original in this forum. He does not want a backward trainee)

It does wonders for the kneecaps that are quite sore from scrubbing the floor with that toothbrush. Also, Gene says
The odor alone keeps pesky neighbors from stopping by and chatting and inteferring with my chores.

[Snowden]

Well, Shar, my knees are a bit sore, now that you mention it. I bunged them a bit on the underside of the neighbor's car when I was working under there yesterday. Whew! It was cold on that driveway! I'm not complaining - I'm a winter person you know.

But I wouldn't want to get sick working for the neighbors, since it may be necessary to rub Bob's back - he can only stand for a while and his knees and back ache. I rub his knees every evening. They hurt him so - from Infantry training during WWII.

I was able to finish the car, although I had to go to the dentist too. A cap! Is that what it is? Anyway, I have to earn the money for that, hence the grease job on the neighbor's car.

Then I finished working on my musical instrument - skittle. Sounds like it should be in a jungle band. *S* Bob is not fond of it, but says I must practice. Just to let him know ahead of time so he can remove his hearing aids.

[Joyous]

Norman, not to dispute your word, but wasn't it a racoon skin for my drum? Perhaps I used a squirrel skin by mistake, but I'm fairly certain Master said to use a racoon skin. Be that as it may.

Master is ever thinking of new ways to keep me fit and in good form. He allows me to walk in the local park in my spare time. It is his contention that walking through snow will build up the leg muscles. Also good for the heart according to him. He allowed me to construct, under his supervision of course, an over the shoulder sort of book rest upon which I can place the training manuel and read it into a recorder as I walk around the track. Master says this will save time and effort for him as he will be able to listen to the recorded manuel while he observes me at my tasks.

Please believe I would NEVER read a post by some charlatan posing as Shar. I am far too busy learning to be frittering away my Master's time on such nonsense.

Thank you, Norman and One-SG for your well spent time training us.:D

[Snowden]

Joyous, you seem to be coming along very well indeed! I hope this will bring you an "A" too!

Shar, only 20 cakes? Well, I know mixing the batter is rather strengthening, but tiring. I did 21 the other day. Mailed them to you so Gene could get his horse sooner; that way he won't get so tired walking around to see you work outside. Bob uses the neighbor's mule, so he suggested I send them for you. He thinks you set such a wonderful example when you were the first of us to realize what a benefit this training program is for us.

Now that he's seen OneSG's beautiful poetry, he is wondering aloud if I should perhaps take lessons in writing poetry. I gently asked if Joyous, who is already a good poet herself, wouldn't fit that position better than I. I can paint, but rhyme is not my talent. He agreed, but pointed out we have no time for such frivolous pursuits until I get the porch screened.

So that's the next project here.

Norman, we are very familiar with Shar's style of writing, and that was definitely not her style. Maybe at one time - but no more!

[Shar]

I am sure each answer deserves its own box so I am bringing these post over separately. Just trying to make up for my lapse
****************************

NORMAN=2/19/03@2:16PM
I couldn't find the thread Shar started about Men Vs Women so I'll post this in here.

OneSG I know how tough it can be when you give women more than 1/2 of slack they usually have to be retrained when they get back. After my wife gets a few hours sleep she has to watch a video I made for her in order for her to get her day started. I never turn the TV or DVD player off otherwise I'd have to get up to turn them on for her. By some miracle she remembers how to push the video in.

It's been warm enough to BBQ here so I thought I'd give her a break and cook today.

I grabbed a beer and went out to check the BBQ grill, she did a good job of cleaning it so all I had to do was get her to light it. Once she did that, while I sipped my beer and watched it she went shopping for the vegetables, meat, paper plates, and so on.

Since my beer was empty & she was to lazy to come out & check on my needs I went inside to grab another one. I asked her to pop the top on it because her hands were clean from washing the vegetables.No sense in me hanging around in the kitchen when the BBQ needed watching. I left her to fix the salad, and prepare the vegetables, side dishes and dessert.
The grill was ready so I hollered in for her to bring out the meat and necessary cooking utensils. She had the meat seasoned ready for grilling; the least she could have done was bring out that stuff so I wouldn't have to raise my voice.

She knew I was upset by her lack of co-operation so on her way out to set the table on our patio she brought me another beer. I must say she did good in her timing because the meat was ready on the grill. All she had to do now was hold the serving platter while I picked the meat off the grill.

After we ate she cleaned up the patio, and was in the kitchen washing the dishes. I came in to watch TV. As I sat there in my easy chair I reflected on what a prince I am for making her day by cooking for her.

Once she had the dishes taken care of, (She has it easy, I bought her an automatic dishwasher)she made coffee and brought my dessert in to me. Feeling pretty good about myself I asked her how she liked having a day off from cooking.

She mumbled something and gave me an annoyed look. I can only conclude that there's just no pleasing some women!!!

[Shar]

Another one brought over
************************
ONE SG-2/19/03@3:16PM

womens work

Norman, Norman, Norman. No no no. You will spoil her. You are making a rod for your own back. One can never do to much for a woman. They take edvanage. I was kind once to my wife. It was her birthday. There were a couple of plates to wash up and, as I was passing the sink, I decided to rinse them for her. Norman!!! She expected it every year. No Norman enough is enough. You have your work to do and they have theirs. When was the last time anyone did one of your chores for you? Remember, too, others are reading this. Shar, Joyous, Snowden Christmas all the other trainees. Whatever will they think? They will all want this attention. You must tell your wife that you had a brainstorm. Did not know what you were doing. Close to a breakdown because of the pressure of watching her all day. Norman put it right quickly.

[Shar]

the last one, as it is proper that a trainee response should be last
**************************
joyous (notice the small letters as opposed to caps for trainees)2/19/03@4:05PM

Norman, One-SG, I have been searching for this post for ages. If I were a man, I would have found it immediately, right?

I hope I'm not telling tales out of school when I say that "Himself" does most of the cooking and allows me to do clean-up. I believe my training is going along fabulously, if I may say so. I was allowed to use a shovel and a broom this morning to remove snow. He says I am not adept enough with machinery to use the snowblower. He hasn't complained about the way I sweep and shovel, other than to say he wouldn't hire me as a helper because of my lack of speed. What does it mean when he grins as he says this?

I am progressing with the drum, I think. I have to muffle the sound which keeps me from knowing if I am actually doing it as I should, but "Himself" must have his sleep and cannot be disturbed by loud banging of drums.

Thank you both for your time

[Shar]

Another lapse..sigh..I should have posted joyous and my response in one box and not taken up valuable space allocated to Norman and One SG
*****************************
shar (note the small letters again)2/20/03@2:13AM


What a slacker I have become

I knew it!! I neglected keeping the "Battle of the Sexes" visible on this board, using the pitiful excuse that I was spending up to 6 hrs a day at the dentist office and then coming home (stopping by the gorcery on my way to pick up special needs for Gene) to cook dinner, as an excuse to go to bed rather than monitoring this topic for instructions. Thank heavens the trainers have the kindness to overlook a lapse once in a while. I really don't know how many lapses we are allowed as this is my first one. That is if you don't count the one where I was
accused , but exonerated where someone was posting under my name and was a rebellious, sneaky, smirking agitator!!

I will immediately find that column and transfer these posts to there so our trainers (and joyous MASTER) will not have to search for it if we are outside and not able to find it for them. ..sigh
************************

I think, I am wasting valuable time sighing?

[Snowden]

Yes, Shar; enough with the sighing already! *G* Actually I think you're doing a wonderful deed, as well as job, in bringing this site under inside control.

So, okay - on second thought, the sighs are okay - after all, it didn't occur to me to bring these posts in out of the snow! At least I think that white stuff is snow, although it has the constituency of concrete. We don't have a snowblower, but a tornado is not apt to move this stuff! It is getting warmer, so that may help.

I'm being a nurse just now - the cars are snuffled up in snow (I make up words from time to time) so no greasing them for now. Anyway, you can put just so much grease on an axle. I've been sick, now Bob is sick, so we are doing little but keeping each other warm and coddled - let it snow!

We're taking time off to go over the plans for house repairs when it is all gone. We've sent for remodelling books and Bob said he will get whatever tools I need that aren't already in the toolchest - just nothing fancy.:(

[Shar]

Joyous and Snowden, I am concerned. It appears we are being left to our own devices. Do you think that ONE and Norman have gone somewhere and found other trainees? OR is this part of the training....that we are eagerly waiting for them? It does tend to cause us to be more pliant and submissive to think we need them to survive. Gene is worried about me lately, says I rush back and forth to the computer looking for them. He is not too happy, says it may fall back on him to finish my training and he has had little luck in two years doing that. He is such a kind and patient man.!

Snowden, thanks for the cakes. Gene is missing much of his much needed rest searching sites on the internet for PasoFino horses. Even had a call or two telling him about them. I think if he finds one before we have bought a place with land, my next project will be draining the pool, building a stall in there and bringing in bales of hay and sacks of grain and spreading sawdust on the floor of the pool. It is a huge, round pool so will make a great arena he says. I really look forward to this.

[Tori]

Shar, before you drain the pool and build the stall you'd better check to see if PasoFino horses can swim. If you get a rain like we had it might be helpful if that is a trait of the breed.

A word of warning before acquiring the horse! In the very first week of the almost 25 years we spent raising dogs, I discovered that mens hands are not built to work a pooper scooper properly. It might be the same thing with a manure rake!

[Snowden]

Shar, it does seem we are being dismissed and left alone to pine over the men. I really thought they were interested in how we turn out, but apparently that was only a temporary winter 'fix' for them and they don't have our best interests at heart at all. It's upsetting to Bob, too.

We've had the same thing here - me running frantically to the computer to see what instructions and/or advice we have for today - and what do I find? Nothing. Silence. We have been abandoned! :(

We are bereft. Maybe we had better toss the whole project and return to being spoiled wives - let the men do the work. But it will never be so much fun. Making the men happy has been such a joy!

I do hope they will return to further advising and training classes.

Tori, the point about the horse swimming is a good one. It's a breed I am not familiar with, so Shar will have to do some research. Happily, she is good at that too.

[DocDiggs]

Norman,

Give em an inch and they take a kilometer!

Yeee gads.... :(

[Snowden]

Doc, did you read the whole thing? Can't you see how we've improved in outlook and performing our wifely duties?

You think this is a joke, I bet - but we're dead serious, and working hard to be better. And better. We're finding the joy of life is making our man as happy as possible. ;)

[norman]

Every quality instructor knows that students have to be given time to practice the skills they've learned. Lack of supervision is not the case. It is the confidence we have in our abilities that allows One & I to step back and observe your progress from a distance.

As you can see by your posts the interaction between all of you has been above average. Very subtle and not noticed by any of you was our promoting your social & communication skills. Tori passing along the knowledge that we have no use for operating a manure rake was a touch of compassion.

We have done so well in your training that snow removal was automatic. Although I didn't see any mention of coming in to make hot chocolate for your husbands.

Snowden is not wasting time while being snowed in, reading about home improvement in her off time shows a great advance in her training. Joyous passed the Raccon test she is learning to pay attention to what is written. Shar while having slipped some in her duties recovered nicely by getting this all together.

Ahhhhhh the joys of doing a job well.

I got so carried away with the training then got caught up in the spirit of Valentines Day that I slipped up and helped out by BBQ'ing. Not a mistake I'll repeat.

[Snowden]

Norman, I nearly smirked here! Decided it would not make my husband happy to have me do that. No, no hot chocolate for him - I have just managed to get some ginger ale properly chilled for his upset tummy. Now he's gone to lie down while I finish studying up on home repairs.

It's nice to know you and OneSG have so much confidence in us - and of course we know you have confidence in your training skills. They are excellent, DocDiggs notwithstanding! He just doesn't realize what you two have accomplished with us.

Well, I must proceed with the manuals. Screening a porch 50' x 14' is a challenge! :rolleyes:

[Tori]

Ah me! I post with fear that I may not be allowed to return to the program. This past week of dealing with the water problem
has thrown us both back into the old habits of working side by side as a team. In the heat of mopping and sopping we each reverted to independent thinking.

Perhaps if I explain my new dilemma Norman and One will consider reinstating my enrollment in the program and at the same time come up with a plan to solve the ongoing problem of flooding.

You see, now we must determine the best way to put a permanant stop to the flooding. Here is the situation as we see it. The flood waters are supposed to flow right through the yards to the alley and on to the drains.

Our neighbor has recently put a block fence around his front and back yards. This means that the normal flow of water is now straight down the street that ends at our driveway, then channeled through our yard by block walls on both sides of us. That flow is obstructed by our ceder fence in the back yard.
It is also compounded because multiple repairs to the alley over the years has raised the alley to 6 inches higher than our yard.

Our options as we see them is to sue the city, (fat chance) take a sledgehammer to the neighbors fences, replace our cedar fence with chain link so the water can flow through unobstructed or dig a trench through the alley. Since moving is not an option, I'm open to all suggestions.

That is if I am allowed to return to the program!

[norman]

Tori I'm having a hard time picturing your property setup. Are there homes after yours where the water flows? or are you the last in line? When you say alley is this a traveled alley or just a fire access road?

I don't know what size the town you live in is but if road work was done on the alley and it causes a drainage problem for you then I'd ask for the city engineers to come out and look at your problem. They may be able to either recommend the city solve the problem or recommend ways for you to do it. Since states, citys and everywhere are cuttuing back because of no money you might have to foot the expense. If that is the way it has to be then those engineers should be able to advise you of what to do and how to do it.

Destroying your neighbors walls might make them a little testy. Putting in a chain link fence might constitute a permanent improvement to your property (becuse the poles are cemeted in) thereby increasing your property tax. Building your own water restraining wall might need permits and mean additional taxes.

I'd start by asking the city for help because of two things.

1. The city has changed the level of the road behind your home.

2. Most likely the city issued a permit for the block walls to be built and the city should have known the effect it would have on water flow.

You pay taxes for things where you live so that those things are to be done according to the common good. Your good is being jepardized by the city & mother nature. With the city creating the problem not mother nature.

[Shar]

Egads, I have such little time and so much to say. AT last one trainer has communicated with us. I was afraid we were all going to have to meet in Acapulco for a week to try to salvage our program and go it on our own.

Instead, Norman came back and it appears we have Doc Diggs to revere now. I hope we don't have to learn the metric system though or change our miles to kilometers, I am very poor at languages and have been known to misjudge measurements.!!

I will have to report in later. I am making a fair attempt at cooking, helping grandson with lessons and finishing painting the bedside stand for Gene so he can eat while lying down and watching television. I told him that lying down eating could cause heartburn, or even messy bedspreads but he got a little huffy.! He even threatened to fax Norman, One and was pawing through the phone book looking for Doc Diggs fax number, to demote me back to phase 2. This phase 3 is so much more complicated. Though I understand ..much more rewarding because all argumentiveness ( what a word..I LOVE IT) is under control and joy and happiness just oozes out of you all time.

I think Mary Poppins is a phase 4

[Tori]

Norman maybe this will give you a better picture.

Our house is on the north side of the alley. There are commercial buildings on the South side.

The alley is wide and gets quite a bit of traffic directly behind our house. It narrows as it goes west.

Picture yourself driving down a street in a residential area on street A. You come to a stop sign at street B. Across street B is a driveway. You must turn right or left onto street B or enter that driveway. That is our house.

The water flows from North to South toward our house unchecked for half a mile down street A. It is supposed to follow the natural course and turn east at street B that runs in front of our house to storm drains on the corner. It usually does.

When the runoff is heavier than normal the excess water from streets A and B used to flow freely between all of the houses on the street, through the back yards and down the alley to storm drains on the surface street C South of us. Our yard is now the only one that the water can flow through unobstructed except for our ceder fence in the rear. Dutch waded out in knee deep water and opened our gate and ripped boards off of our fence to let the water out but it was too late, the alley was flooded.

In the last few years our neighborhood has attracted mostly hardworking Mexican immigrants who have brought their love of decorative block fences with them. There are 10 houses on our side of the street and our neighbor to the west of us was the last to put up a block fence a few months ago. Only two houses on street B don't have them. one of them is us and the other is another long term resident who is on higher ground than we are.

One thing you said in your post struck home. Not one of them bothered to get permits to build those fences! They just all got together on a weekend and with the assistance from umpteen cases of beer put the darned things up. I have to admit though they do dress up the neighborhood!

I am going to contact the city by email about the alley since I can't find a phone number to talk to a real person. First I have to get my thoughts together so I can explain what happened in a clear and concise manner. If that doesn't work I have a back up plan.

The city is going to be moving our water meters from the alley to the street side of the houses in the next few months. If I'm lucky maybe we'll be able to catch a superviser we can talk to while the work is going on.

One interesting note about the whole thing with the block fences.
All fences are supposed to be set back a certain distance from the property line. Every one of them is right on that line!

A few years ago a car went through our split rail fence in the front yard. When the estimater from the fence company came out he commented that every one of them could be fined or told to move them back.

We're not going to order the new carpeting until we're sure it won't be ruined by flooding.

[norman]

Tori your description made sense to me I can picture what you described. As I see it along with water damage there is the possibility of having a lot of angry neighbors if the city started to investigate and fine them for no permits and not building to code and using a setback.

Since the walls add to the neighborhood would it be to costly to ask some of your neighbors to build a wall for you? You of course supply the materials because your cost would be chaeper than someone buying the materials. Naturally a set price would have to be agreed on 1st. Only problem would be if you wanted to do it legally and filed for a permit. That might tip off the city to the other illegal ones. A delicate situation for you to consider. Build with a set back with no permit or get a permit and possibly cause untold grief. You probably have a sense of what you could get away with.

If you did decide to have a wall too I think I'd add a swinging gate at your driveway entrance, one that could have at least a two foot water barrier attached to the bottom of it. That way you could block the water yet have a usable drive way entrance. For convenience the gate could be left open all the time and closed when heavy rain is forecast.

I don't know the height of the other walls but just for decorative sake lets imagine your wall to be 4 ft high and double wide. visualize a wall planter the full length of your front. A foot wide would be plenty. The end post or wall for the driveway could be 6 ft tall to hold the gate. Between the walls you could plant ivy or flowers or both and make it something really unique to look at.

I suppose cost could be looked at if the wall was there carpeting would be a once and done purchase so the wall would pay for itself sort of.

If they are going to move meters this summer maybe if they are going to use a trencher you could ask them to build up the back part of your property to block any rain run off from coming onto your property that way. They could berm the alley a little bit and use the excess to add height at your property line.

Hope this gave you some help if not the good thing is it didn't cost anything to ask. :D

[Tori]

Norman thank you! I've saved your post and will add your suggestions to our options. I love the idea of a wall topped with flowers and greenery!

There may be good news. Our next door neighbor to the east has contacted the city. They have been there 24 years and for the third time this year their whole house was flooded.

Representatives of the city were at her door within two days and seem eager to help solve the problem. She forgot to mention the alley height so I am going to email them about that.

Two voices should be able to accomplish more than one!

;)

[Snowden]

That wall does sound like it would be lovely. Tori, to help protect the other neighbors, would it be possible to have a drainage ditch run along the side of your property? The wall would be a barrier to that point, then the water - if it could pass through there to the rear of your property - could flow along the wall, turn into the ditch and run back.

We have ditches here, on both sides, front and back of our property. This is country, of course, which is probably a whole different layout.

Of course, I'd try your idea first about sending the email.

[norman]

The learning process is never ending. Today will be about a technique called reverse visual demonstrations. The object of the lesson is to learn what “NOT” to do by showing the
results of what happens when you try to accomplish a task by taking a short cut.

Never one to waste food I’ve taught my pupil to dry the ends of french bread for use as cubes for stuffing or to be ground and mixed with various spices as breading. The task of grinding in the food processor is where the lesson takes place. Given to complaining occasionally she voiced her displeasure at having to switch off the machine& wait for the blades to stop so she could add more bread pieces. Knowing full well what would happen and in order for me to show her that there are times when haste makes waste I explained to her about the top being the safety latch. If you twist the top the machine stops right
away. The step of turning off the switch is eliminated. Theoretically a time saver. I went on to show her that by removing the top by the time you got the top off the blades might be stopped. This is where the “real” learning took place.

With the top removed & the blades still rotating the few lumps of bread in the powdered bread crumbs were free to kick up and splatter the crumbs all over the kitchen. It took over 1/2 hour of her clothes washing in the wash tub time away from her to clean up the mess. She learned that it isn’t safe to remove the top because the blades don’t stop & that rather then save time she had more work to do.

Reverse visual training works but I don’t advise using it very often, some other tasks could be left undone or only partially done due to time constraints.

[Joyous]

Norman, (she asks blushingly) may I compliment you on your methods of teaching YOUR pupil? I will apply this lesson to my own tasks, should I ever be allowed to use the food processor, or the blender. I AM allowed to use the can opener. Does this mean I have reached phase 2?

Shar seems to be the most apt pupil in the training program. This is not to besmirch Snowden who is excellent in the department of being pleasing to her trainer. She must be as he seems to smile often.

I will be advancing tomorrow morning if we get the promised snow. I know I should stop complaining about 10 inches of snow when it presents a golden opportunity to please Master, and to build needed muscles. I doubt I shall ever reach Mary Poppins level.:o

[Snowden]

Oh, Joyous, you are so dear - I know you will please your mate. How could he help but appreciate so much good cheer and hard work to please him?

Now I am having a problem with Bob. He's saying things like, "I think I miss my old girl." and "I think I liked you better the way you were before..."

He never quite ends that sentence, and he says I have misunderstood him when I ask about it. But it worries me. If I keep trying so hard to please him, how could he want me to stop learning how to do so better?

[Joyous]

Snowden, at the risk of raising the ire of our trainers, regarding Bob's "Missing the old girl"? Some men are never pleased! Now I fear I am going to be demoted to phase one again.

Will the fact I stood toe to toe with Master this morning,with shovel at the ready, keep me at level two? Norman Sir, I am overjoyed that you are pleased with my notice of the racoon mix-up. I now know that you were merely testing me. I thank you for that. Please allow me to toot my own horn by telling you that I made tea for Master when he came inside from the shoveling this morning.

Have you and One-SG been pleased enough with our progress that you will concede to continue with the program? I would surely be disappointed if we caused you to drop us and wash your hands of us entirely.

Our dear Shar must be putting in the floor or baking more cakes for the purchase of Gene's horse. She appears to be too busy to post. And may I put in a good word for Tori? I hope you will see fit to allow her to return to the program. She seems sufficiently contrite.

[norman]

Joyous it is sheer joy for a trainer when he discovers a trainee that will branch out on her own occasionally to learn more.

Not only making & learning drum making and playing but now tooting your own horn. An explanation of the material the horn is made of would or could be useful to the other trainees. Who knows they too made want to practice tooting their own horn.

Tea ?? with no description of what kind. You are slipping. One of the primary functions of a trainee is to share knowledge. Little things like was sugar used or a substitute. Honey or cinamon. All kinds of minor details help you to improve self expression; not to mention help your memory by describing the various ingriedients.

I won't say you are slipping only that you have not progressed quite as much as I had hoped. That is constructive not meant to return you to the point of where many women are and that is one of feeling inferior and not capable of performing even the most minor task.

[norman]

Todays lesson in communication. We all know it is difficult to explain a point of view using only written words. The lack of body language, vocal tone, all help when communicating face to face. Then there are people that will take a post and pull only selected portions out of it making whatever you had to say seem totally opposite.

Two examples using the pics of Shar that were posted.

1. Shars looks terrific in the avitar

2. Shar looks terrific with her clothes on or off.


Same thought just expressed differently.

As you might have noticed OneSG and I have always tried to make ourselves perfectly clear in what we say. Never posting something that could be misconstrued.

[OneSG]

Right Norman. No abiguity I have maintained all along that women are second class citizens. As outlined in the scriptures woman were made to serve men. There is no abiguity about it. What you and I are promoting is scriptual truth. I will find some scriptures when I have a few minutes just to show how the women of today are slackers.

[Joyous]

Norman Sir, the tea was decafinated with a touch of soy milk. Nothing more. As for the horn, I made it from some scrap metal Master had left about. The sound needs improving, but I assure I will work on it. I do see the subtlety in how a sentence is written, pertaining to the quote about Shar. Thank you for pointing it out to us.

One-SG, you are of course correct (as if you could be otherwise?) in saying it is bibical that women submit to their husbands. Paul also told the men how they should treat their wives, and I must admit that both you and Norman are a shining example. :D

[DocDiggs]

I read prodigously (sp?), Snowden; but be serious? Flipancy! Mea culpa, mea magna culpa, mea culpa ad nauseum.... I shall be serious and seriously get my serious butt out of this serious process. :p

[Joyous]

Hey Doc,lighten up! :cool:

Where ARE our respected trainers? No doubt they're peeking to try and catch us at some error.

[Snowden]

DocDiggs, you know I love you dearly, but you do of course realize that this section is precisely to avoid being serious! I know you realize it - that post is hilarious! :D

[Joyous]

At the risk of showing my female shortcomings, I admit that I can't find the topic I am searching for. I wanted to comment on the eggshell tip Norman gave us. I cannot seem to find the topic.

Ladies, why are we being neglected by our trainers? What have we done? Maybe only one of us is guilty, but which one of us? I admit to having done very little today. Master was rather involved in his pursuits, leaving me to such mundane tasks as cleaning shelves, vacuuming the Raggedy Ann dolls, etc.

I'm in blue funk because I feel useless. Even the trainers have deserted me. :(

Norman, One-SG, come back to those who need you?

[Snowden]

Joyous, the topic you want is called "Forgevness." The third thread in the Forgiveness trio, and happily a typo overlooked so it's easier to find!

I'm sure our leaders are watching from afar - don't despair. Bob and OneSG exchanged poems today, with the following results:

By OneSG:

Hell Has No Fury

Hell doth have no fury like any woman scorned.
Raging like a banshee beautifully adorned.
When her eyes are angered see the grimaced face.
Femininity has gone now, gone all thoughts of grace.
Nails sprout like talons ready for the fight.
Like a fierce monster defending what is right.
I will not arouse the anger of one so disposed.
I yield the confrontation. Incident is closed.

My husband's reply:

What can a husband answer to one so rich in verse?
He cannot match the golden prose, and to make it even worse,
His hair is thin, his stories old, his chest below his waist.
He doubts that he still has the stuff for which her heart once raced.
He bows his head and sighs out loud, may even shed a tear.
What can he do to end his woe, to help him when he's drear?
What can he do to ease the pain and keep what he holds dear?
Maybe go down the pub and have a pint of beer.

You see, our men are in contact with our teachers.

[OneSG]

How perplexing it is becoming. I gave permission for the trainees to try their hand at joined up writing and then find some of them are not even competent at English. Marianne's post of
02-21-2003 01:19 AM makes plain that she needs to make up her own words so deficient is she in expressing herself in English. This pupil is also unsure what constitutes snow. I can understand, to some extent, that some trainees living in more temperate climes will never have seen snow. These may be excused for this deficiency in knowledge but for Marianne to have forgotten what snow looked like from the previous winter is rather perplexing. I wonder if it comes down to attention span/memory loss or are these women just un-trainable?

Joyous is progressing well but is taking advantage of a kind master. She is well aware that he will pick up a shovel and assist her with the snow removal if she makes it look difficult. This is a devious attempt to raise his blood pressure in the hope that he may well collapse thus allowing her to find another master.

Tori. I would have thought the women in your neighbourhood could all get together with pickaxe and shovels and dig some drainage ditches for yourselves instead of expecting the hard pushed men to do the job for you all. The exercise would be good for muscle toning and increasing stamina.

Shar is spending far too much time at the dentist. Is this man handsome? Is he married? Are you just making excuses to see him? You can firmly grit your teeth and speak through them at the same time so I can see no problems in the denture department. Is all this just a guise to get out of chores?

The next phase of training must be postponed until all deficiencies are mastered and skiving ceases.

[Snowden]

Ah, OneSG - how have I disappointed you? How could you think I would forget what snow looks like, although this is the first year we've had enough to settle on the ground and remain through the day.

It's snowing heavily right now. Lovely. But I must admit, I have no idea what you mean by "joined up writing." By the way, I make up words quite a lot - it used to confuse Bob, but he enjoys it now.

Well, I'm busy taking down the Christmas trees and must get back to that. Since it's too early for planting the garden and the toys, a definite hazard for this unbalanced old lady, have been removed for a spell by my daughter-in-law, I must clean the two rooms and get on with it.

Shar's dentist is not handsome, I'm sure. She's true blue, she is.

[Joyous]

One-SG, I see I am unable to decieve you in any way. You are so intuitive, so on the ball. I stand corrected and shall improve my status forthwith.

Are you not being a wee bit hard on Shar? Her smile is of such importance to her dear Gene. It does a man proud to be seen to have a good looking server-wife-woman.
Pardon me for speaking out so boldly.

By the by, where is your sidekick, Norman? Are you the lone trainer? I pray you will not abandon us midstream.

And whats this about Snowden mixing words? metaphors?:D

[OneSG]

Yes, Shar; enough with the sighing already! *G* Actually I think you're doing a wonderful deed, as well as job, in bringing this site under inside control.

So, okay - on second thought, the sighs are okay - after all, it didn't occur to me to bring these posts in out of the snow! At least I think that white stuff is snow, although it has the constituency of concrete. We don't have a snowblower, but a tornado is not apt to move this stuff! It is getting warmer, so that may help.

I'm being a nurse just now - the cars are snuffled up in snow (I make up words from time to time) so no greasing them for now. Anyway, you can put just so much grease on an axle. I've been sick, now Bob is sick, so we are doing little but keeping each other warm and coddled - let it snow!


Second paragraph. ( I think that white stuff is snow )


Third paragraph. ( the cars are snuffled up in snow )

[Joyous]

Pardon One-SG, but isn't necessity the mother of invention? Was it not necessary for Snowden to coin a new word when in doubt about the consistency of the white stuff? Should I stand corrected?

Has Norman taken a sabbatical from his duties as co-trainer? Is this a good model of self discipline? Perhaps he merely requires a rest from his mental labor. We are an unruly bunch at times. Hurry back Norman. One-SG is an apt teacher, but I fear he may wear himself out. :eek:

[Snowden]

I confessed the made-up word, but I believe it's a real word - a good word. Usually we think of puppies as snuffling (?) and in fact one of my French Poodle pups snuffled so much we named him Snuffles. Of course, I don't know what his owner named him when we gve him away - but he was a cute little rascal.

Now we are heading into still another winter storm mess coming today - but it hasn't started yet. I hope it's not more of the same. Late winter - well it was early too. This year we had a whole winter! Unusual for here.

OneSG you may like to know I stayed up and took down the second Christmas tree last night. Odds and ends still are around, but Bob enjoys the Christmas tree lights so much this year. He is seeing the colors so much more clearly now that his eye operation is so successful.

[norman]

Ladies I have been busy with instructions at home. The attention span has improved greatly but the retention is really lacking.

Years ago I taught her about about PVC & copper tubing plumbing. & some basic electrical. All forgotten. :(

She forgot everything when it came to plumbing in a whole house water filtering system using PVC. Sizing and tightening of compression fittings for an under the sink water filter. Sweating in copper tubing to add a water supply to an automatic ice maker & adding a ground fault outlet for a new waste disposal unit all easy but a mystery to her. The sheer terror of her adding an electrical out let was a sight to see.

I hate to shirk my duties here but when it comes to sitting and watching to make sure she does everything right I have to apply my talents where needed most.

Overall she did OK the main complaint I have is she didn't draw off some water for my coffee before starting on the water filter projects. I think some laziness hit her and she didn't want to stop and make coffee for me.

[Snowden]

Oh, poor Norman - what a day! How did you stay awake without the coffee? You don't suppose that was the real motive, do you? Oh, I'm sure it wasn't - she wouldn't do that. Probably she was just trying to remember how to go about the job.

I was glad for the plumbing lessons. Our sink backed up and I had to attach a piece of pipe because the original was too narrow and had been put in on the level instead of at a slant. I wonder what the builder of this house was thinking of! :confused:

It meant crawling under the house about 50 feet to make the connection - and I thought greasing cars got me dirty! Of course the melting snow was no help - just wet and muddy under there since the snow wasn't there, just the melt. My coveralls were a mess.

But it's nice to see the water draining easily now. Bob is very happy with the finished job.

[DocDiggs]

:confused:

Joyous:

Pls see Snowden's comment immediately following yours. Sorry that my humor is so dry as to be dessicated....

-30-

[Shar]

As you can see, my picture has been removed and cannot be put back until ONE has commenced training and Norman is evidently doing the same because of problems at home. (I am beginning to wonder about the competency of these 2 trainers--the inability of getting us all under control)

ONE, I definitely took your words to heart. I asked myself (while I was peeling potatoes) did I have an ulterior motive for going to the dentist? Is a 36 yr old man too young for a 67 yr. old woman? Is he really that cute or was that "wanting to cuddle him" just the motherly instinct coming out? I finally recognized the sighs were not due to exhaustion, but merley more of a swoon type thing. I have spent these last couple of days bringing myself back up to par..to the # 3 level. Gene seems to feel he is only a monitor that ensures I put into practice the "enlightened" velvet glove instruction of the two of you. I concede. Capitulate, whatever.

I did appreciate the time off as I was yearning for the old days of being ..overbearing, demanding, argumentative, etc . During that time I believe I got that all out of my system by telling the dentist to get his grubby hands off of that bridge with those wires all around my teeth and I would take care of that myself. You see, his root canal work, the crowns, the one filling....that was fine...he was jicking around with those wires and squeezing my teeth to the highest pain level...sigh..whoops, there I go again. Maybe I will get that under control again before training commences.

I am an open vessel, ready for learning, retaining the old knowlege and open to the next phase.

Thank you Norman, thank you ONE SG, my life is more healthful, happy husband, learning new tricks...no...X that..gaining new knowlege and eager to begin again.

When may I have my picture back?

[norman]

Post the pic immediately Shar. There is a certain amount of balance needed in here. No fun staring at text only. I am afraid with all the work you have been doing you have lost your sense of decor.

When if comes to your dentist I am betting it is a math equasion based on the principals of division.

Question, Do wires and drilling replace whips & shackles ? Meant only as learning about dental restraint procedures lest anyones wild imagination goes some place else.

I can see where learning has bettered your life. Gene can relax a lot more now and he deserves to be relaxed. Actually all the husbands need the relaxation it isn't easy having to be vigilant 24/7. Thank goodness for video cams; we can get some sleep now while you all continue with the household chores. Although that wax thing you all do is more than we need to know about. In my official capacity as instructor I relieve you all of having to capture that particular action as proof of maintaining the perfect look. Keep the perfection just skip the filming.

Snowden, Joyous, & Tori have been lax in some of the chores but that is to be expected when not watched constantly. We knew this could happen but decided to run a little test to make sure.

[OneSG]

Butterfly

Gossamer coated wings of a beautiful butterfly.
Allow the zigzag course beneath the sunlit sky.
Carried by the wind indecisive and unrushed.
Never in a hurry never to be fussed.
Beautifully adorned regal raiment of a queen.
Never knowing where she’s going never caring where she’s been.
Silent in her purpose knowing not her quest.
Seeking out the nectar seeking place of rest.
Harmless butterfly dancing in the midday sun.
Never making sounds never knowing fun.
Lovely little queen dancing in the air.
Never with a worry never with a care.

[Joyous]

Do I detect a bit of favoritism here by our marvelous trainer One-SG? It's Snowden this and Snowden that! :mad:


Tee hee, sorry I couldn't help myself.

One-SG, the poem is one of the better ones you have posted. Indeed beautiful.

Now may I come to the defense of Shar? I well know the lure of "The Old Ways". and it is SO difficult to remain loyal to the cause when the long-time habits come niggling at the psyche.

Yes Norman, it is true that I haven't done any chores of late. But hear my side of the story. I have been away earning my salt. Now that I am back in the fold, I shall put forth every effort to regain the respect of yourself and that of One-SG. (She bows low before the Exalted ones)

[Joyous]

Trainers, Sirs, may I say what a lovely photo Snowden has offered to brighten the screen?

This may explain why she has been lax in her chores. When one is photographing such lovely creatures, one hardly has time to be doing such mundane tasks as making tea for the husband. Do you not see that monies will be forthcoming from the eventual sale of said photos?:D

[Snowden]

Joyous, what a marvelous idea! To sell my pictures. Sadly, I took a job instead of getting on with my paintings, so I missed that market entirely! I told Bob last night that if I had done the painting we may be rich now. But this house is small, too many people and no room to paint.

So we are considering a room on part of the oversized back porch. I have been studying construction during this snowy winter - screen part of it, turn part into an inner sanctuary for the two of us (we should live so long!) and perhaps paint. Of course, with the economy going south, it's unlikely I can learn enough, remember enough and paint enough to make any money.

Well, I'll put another picture here for your enjoyment.

[norman]

Just when Joyous finally gets back into the training I have to take a short break in the training sessions.

Seems my trainee has been hinting about wanting a cultural experience by visiting a foreign country. Well not really to foreign just a little south of us with one of those funny names.

She attaches some importance to having been a servant for the last 41 years as of tomorrow. I think a week in Cancun should be enough to renew her enthuasiam.

Since this was a surprise for her she is both happy and a little upset at not having an advance warning. Clothes are an issue all of the sudden, what to wear? Nothing!! seemed to me to be the best answer but now she wants to eat out and see things. Wayyyyyyyy different than the wedding night. I suppose I should expect some changes.

Keep safe and do well whilst I'm away.

[Snowden]

Well, ladies, we're being abandoned. I understand OneSG is away for a couple days and Norman is deserting us for a whole week.

Also, despite his reluctance to buy new clothes for his trainee, he seems to be catering to her to a delightfully human degree. Maybe the trainers are being influenced and want life to return to where they take care of their charges instead of training us and them to take care of our collective men!

Does this mean that our hard work is for naught?

[Joyous]

Ladies, ever hear the expression, while the cat is away, the mice will play? Does that give you any ideas? With both Norman and One-SG gone, we can loll about, eating bon-bons, watching soap operas, twiddling our thumbs, or flirting with the postman. What say you? :p

[Shar]

Uh, JOyous, sounds like a great idea. Would you give me a few hours to.....change dental arrangements"

[Snowden]

Well, Joyous, I don't know about the postman - a bit young for me. But we do have Catman, Quentin, and a few others to flirt with. And who knows? When OneSG and Norman get back, maybe a bit of flirting with them?

Joyous, we are not behaving ourselves. Great, isn't it? Maybe Bob is right and I should resign from this course and go my merry way.

Of course, right now I'm studying this book on construction, and it is rather interesting....

And they may have left a spy somewhere - you have to think of that!

[Shar]

Snowden, we must have been posting at the same time.. :rolleyes:

I do think you are correct about the spy. Remember, they "supposedly" could not see a post in the other forum that was also "supposedly" attributed to me but THEY DID...Either there is a
monkey in the woodpile as the picture I posted above indicates..or..they have supernatural powers.

I think we should all have a meeting in a secret place to talk about this and plan .....well.....a plan. What you think?

[Snowden]

Shar, I think that's a very good idea - a conference among us who were willing to become part of this training course.

I do think we are seeing a double standard here - I mean, Norman has been spoiling his personal trainee like mad lately. And as we hear of that in our teachers, and then our husbands - Bob, at least, getting sad at the change in us - me. Well!

This will take some careful thought.

Yes, a private conference is definitely in order!


I feel the danger coming on back into my life. Ummmm

[sweetheart]

wow just realised I'm being trained. My trainer.......(he is so kind)........said he would let me make lunch......while he sat in the sun taking in the our new autumn sun........then he might do some tidy ing in the garden.....

[edith]

I saw that tiger, Snowden. It is great. I recently found a site for my high school online. It was just wonderful after 41 years to read about what has happened to the people I graduated with! Our mascot was the tiger. The same tiger is on the homepage for our school.

I went to an American NATO school in France back when it was in NATO the first time around. After graduation, we scattered literally around the world and I lost touch. My two best friends were Turkish girls whose father's were in NATO. I actually found them again. One is living in Ankara, Turkey and is married to a Dutchman. The other one is living in Santa Barbara, CA -- just down the road from me!

I read back and see I am off topic here and better get back to it. I'm one of the untrainable ones. I have no trainer and (hanging head in shame) no desire to learn. I guess I'll just watch what is going on and check your progress here *VBG*

[Joyous]

Sweetheart, how kind indeed of your trainer to allow you to make lunch while he relaxes. You have a fine man there. Hang onto him!

Edith, I was once much like you, highly untrainable, but Norman and One-SG have made me see the error of my ways. True I do slip back into the old ways now and again, but my heart is set on becoming a Mary Poppins! :D

(P.S. Snowden, Shar, where and when do we meet in secret?)

[Joyous]

It would seem our honorable One=SG has decided to abandon the program. Norman has gone off on his merry way to God knows where while we wallow in the misery of having no direction. We are set asail rudderless. Like ships at a rough sea. What is to become of us, the original class? :(

[Snowden]

Gone but not forgotten - right, Joyous? But they will return.

The real question is, will we return? To the mild-mannered, well-trained females we were working on being. I've enjoyed a good old-fashioned flirt today. Granted it was with my husband, but you have to start with what's at hand, doncha know. And he cooperates so handsomely!

This may be the better way after all - just to relax and be ourselves. Now where did I put that book on construction? Ah, excuse me, girls - I'm really quite caught up in this......


Maybe I'll try for something bigger than a room on the porch.........

[Joyous]

Snowden, I always feel you are smiling a secret little smile to me! LOve it!

I believe we could lead One-SG a merry chase while Norman is away, but then Shar has gone as well. Are the two of us up to the tow on one?:confused:

[Shar]

HO HO HO, all packed and ready to leave early in the morning. I bet Norman comes back an easier trainer to deal with and ONE is getting softer the more poetry he writes. Be easy on him ladies................and.....Gene has been so busy talking about the trip he is forgetting to monitor me in their absence!

I was thinking..*G*..you know, it is now against the law to have more than one wife, also it is pretty expensive to divorce. But, at one time, before the age of modern conveniences, women were just keeling over right and left. Childbirth got them, hauling water, chopping word, scrubbing clothes, cooking over a fireplace or an old wood or coal stove, training children, getting the washtub ready and then scrubbing her husbands back. She almost always died in middle age and then they got a younger one. Do you think......surely not.....but do you think, this just could be in the back of Norman and ONE's minds?

I knew I would start thinking if we ever got out from under all of those chores. I mean, I even started getting away from being proud of being a phase 3. No more was I thinking it was good for me. Still, some of what they instilled in us is holding on. If, that isn't their reason...............

don't you think they may have to go back to phase 1 with all of us? .They should have not left new recruits alone this length of time....Why Gene is actually looking forward to me driving all the way to Ohio. He loaded my suitcase in the car this evening. He came upstairs and made us sandwiches. Either I am falling behind or he is not with the program. This could really pose a problem for those 2 nice guys that seem to be honest in their endeavors. But then, sometimes I see a little smirk when they are talking...and I know now how they realized I was speaking thru clenched teeth...why just yesterday, I saw ONE clench his teeth.

It really is something to think about.

[Snowden]

Shar, that's a very serious thing to realize! That they are smirking and trying to do us in so our mates can have newer versions!

Like trading in a car! Well, I'll have to sleep on that idea. Sounds like a definite possibility. We'll have to withdraw and think about this. Very disappointing. Why, with Norman gone, has One even glanced in here?

Joyous, two on one will work - it always does.

But - I'm afraid someone is watching.

[OneSG]

SHAR! I NEVER speak through clenched teeth. Or speak with forked tongue for that matter. And to think Norman and I would be trying to finish you off just so that you could be traded in Ohh dear.:eek:

The retraining of new models is a long and arduous task. It is just not worth doing this for a newer whim.

Two on one hmmmm food for thought. Are you really planning to give me the run around? I think you three would have been good in Colditz.

[Tori]

I have no clue as to why this post was so long it had to be posted in three separate parts. There are many much longer.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As I'm sure many of you have realised by now; I must regretfully and reluctantly withdraw from the program.

My efforts to learn and be formed into the complete wife have been thwarted at every turn and sabatoged from within my own household!

Without a willing and eager trainer I simply don't see any possible way such a metamorphis can occur.

I've tried in many ways, some subtle and some not so subtle and barely made it into phase one.

Normally I'm not a quitter but in the last weeks I've tried lawn work only to have the mower taken away for fear I would damage it. The rocks I tried to mow were no more than a half to one pound apiece! Not a single one of them hit the picture window as he feared they would!

[Tori]

My next project was washing Dutch's truck.
He said I would scratch the finish with the brillo pad and took the hose away from me and finished it himself. No sooner did I begin washing my own car than he complained that I wasn't getting the roof clean and suggested I sit down while he showed me the right way to wash a vehicle.

Knowing that there are some things I have learned to do correctly in the last 50 years, I returned to the house and got out the vacuum cleaner. Wouldn't you know he came in and castigated me for pushing the self propelled vacuum too fast. He took it away from me to show me how to use it properly. When I asked for it back he informed me that there was nothing else to vacuum.

[Tori]

As a last resort I entered the kitchen to prepare a meal.
That wasn't good enough either. He had decided we would eat out since I was probably to tired from watching him mow the lawn, wash the vehicles and vacuum the carpets.

I hope all of you understand that I took this program very seriously and was willing to give it my best effort. Old habits are hard to break. I am heartbroken of course to know that I have failed the course before even getting started. As hard as it is to admit though, I'm sure I will eventually adjust to the fact that I must continue being a spoiled wife!

I will be watching the progress of the remaining trainees with wishes that they will have more success than I did!

[Snowden]

What is "Colditz," OneSG?

Tori, I'm having the same problems with my so-called trainer. He refuses to let me even know where he hides the vacuum, let alone use it. When we are together he insists on cooking, all the while apologizing because he says I'm a better cook - or takes me out to dinner.

He has hidden the tools for me to take care of the car. Says he wants his "old girl" back - I'm developing muscles where no woman should have muscles, he tells me! But he does enjoy the massages. Joyous sent me instructions how to do that.

All in all, I think the classes are being chipped away bit by bit by the men themselves. Maybe they fear strong women? Or just want us to be their playmates?

He made my coffee this morning and offered to prepare breakfast. Now he's happily reading the paper.


Tori, it looks like we're both returning to spoiled wifehood! Not a bad deal, since we showed our willingness to be trained... ;)

[OneSG]

Colditz was a secure POW prison. Used by the Germans to contain men liable to escape.

[Joyous]

What goes on here? Am I being abandoned to the trainers? My co-horts are fleeing the class? I shall await the return of Shar and see what happens then. I was the most reluctant to enter the program and now it would appear I am to go it alone! :mad:

(Is this part of the "cats away, mouse will play" routine?)

Colditz aye? So we now know where to send recalcitrant mates.

[Snowden]

Well, Joyous - now we know OneSG is back but apparently indifferent as to whether or not we are!

And I've learned that Colditz was a POW prison - when and in what country, OneSG? WWII, apparently, and England? Anyway, you would have Norman back next week. Perhaps you just want to wait for him and give us a vacation. It may be a permanent one, of course. Time will tell!

[OneSG]

Colditz is a castle in Germany. It was used to contain habitual escapees. It is quite notorious so it should be mentioned in Google or ask Jeeves or some such encyclopedic gizzmo.

[Joyous]

There are some beautiful castles in Germany. Wasn't it Ludwig III who gutted the economy of Germany with his madness? Building castles as if there were no tomorrow? I visited two and at the moment I cannot correctly spell the names. Neustchanstien or something near. The other was pronounced "Kimsee" but that isn't how its spelled. Marvels both. The trek up to Neustchanstien ,or whatever ,was good for the leg muscles. When we were there, a few of our group visited Dauchau, but I knew I couldn't stand to see where so many people had suffered and died.

This is hardly the topic for this post, but forgive me.

[LadyM]

I stumbled into the discussions going on in the training classes, and although I don't qualify for such training, I had to tell all of you that I have laughed uproariously and thoroughly enjoyed the repartee between trainers and students. It is my opinion that this comedic farce should be taken on tour. I am certain that it would be a huge success and that you all would at the very least be nominated for the coveted Tony Awards. My kudos to all.

[Tori]

Welcome Lady M!

Isn't it great to run across a forum dedicated to just plain having fun?

Hope to see more posts from you very soon.

A good way to get acquainted is to post in the Over The Back Fence or This Has Been My Day discussions and tell us a little bit about yourself and where you live.

[OneSG]

I must tell all of you that Lady M is, in fact, my mother in-law. She is trying to discredit the training programme by making everyone think of it as a joke.
Your cover has been blown Ma. Now please return to the back yard and continue with the wood chopping.
Now Tori has decided to quit we will need a new Guitarist and mother in-law is trying to scupper any chance of replacing her. She thinks she can be in the group if no one else is available. "It is better than chopping wood" she says.
So please ignore any comments describing the programme as a "farce" I can assure you all that Norman and I are quite serious in our efforts.

( welcome M )

[Snowden]

Lady M, we've had a lot of fun with it - I'm glad you have enjoyed it. OneSG and Norman started it, and after a couple false starts (and the occasional bits of rebellion, as in the current discussions) we have been pretty good at thinking up things to do for fun.

Some have thought it absurd, and life must have its little absurdities or it's just not worth living. Take it on the road - love the idea! I think though, that it would need younger people.

Wouldn't it be a fun comedy!? Hmmmmmm Think there would be any money in it? ;) If so, then it would be for the men who have been so carefully training us.

By the way, there is always room for another trainee. I'm sure you are more than welcome! The only qualification you need is to be a woman - and with your name, there's no question about that!

[LadyM]

Snowden

I have to disagree with your assessment that younger people would be needed for the tour. They simply would not have the panache to put it over. Definitely needs the older guys and dolls.
As for the money, who needs money when you are having fun.

[OneSG]

Limitations

I know my limitations. I’m not much good I know.
My forte is not D. I. Y. but I will have a go.
I know my limitations , and yes, I saw you frown.
The day I built the garden wall and you saw it fall down.
I am not much good at gardening but I will have a go.
I planted trees and watered them but only weeds would grow.
I know my limitations. I try so hard to please.
You ask me how I mess things up, I can do that with ease.
I made a garden shed. I made it out of wood.
Maybe a little crooked. Okay then...It’s no good.
I spruced the back door step up and left the cement wet.
It weren’t my fault the cat got stuck. We did not need the vet.
I know my limitations. I made a chair for you.
The one you cannot sit on. The one you said “ will do”.
I know my limitations. A useless man I am.
I love you though my darling. I do the best I can.

[LadyM]

OneSG

My dear son-in-law,

I realize that you and Norman are quite serious and sincere in your efforts to assist the ladies in maintaining their loving relationships. So, for now, I will not reveal that it is I who has you in the pantry polishing the silver, or fetching my tea and scones, and replying with a polite "Yes, my lady or No, my lady "(whichever response is appropriate at the time) to my wishes.

But, mind you lad, I"ll be keeping an eye on you, just to ascertain that you don't get too puffed up with what you might perceive as self-importance.

With regards
Your M-I-L

(tks sg for the welcome. Just you make sure there are no spots on that silver)

[LadyM]

Tori,

Yes, it is fun and we all need a little ray of sunshine in our lives now and then. A smile, a giggle or a big knee-slapping laugh makes for a brighter day and as Mary Poppins would say,"makes the medicine of life go down a bit easier.

[Snowden]

How lovely to at last hear from the mother-in-law! OneSG, it seems you also are traveling under false colors. Or should I say "colours?" Delightful.

I am so glad you decided to remain with us, LadyM - and you must tell us how the ear is mending! And was it your ear? Can it be......? Oh, perish the thought! Can it be the ear of our very own teacher, OneSG? Should I ask such a question, even trembling as I am in my nightie?

Now here we have Norman treating his trainee to a week's vacation in Cancun and OneSG polishing silver! What secrets will leak out next?

Shar is away - also a treat! Tori and I are teetering on the edge of retirement from the classes while Joyous and I toy with the delightful thoughts of once again becoming sex symbols.

Hey, gang - things are getting more and more like real life. We have to do something about that!

[OneSG]

Is there no end to this? The woman is delusional! It must be the ear. She struts around looking like Spock from Star Trek. We are thinking of having the tip snipped off to make her more human looking.
Where did this back chat come from? That is no way to find a place in the skiffle group. She was okay until she had the urge to locate truffles. I thought this was to be a nice little earner. Dunno now. She is trying to think. One of the Rules" in the training programme is do not think. You are all ill equiped. Let your man do it for you.

[Snowden]

OneSG, my man is sleeping - and I'm leaving for a while. Back later in the day to see if you can regain control of the others! :D

As for myself - I'll think about it!

[LadyM]

Delusional is it? Off my bonkers, you think? Have always been able to think for myself and so far have been bloody good at it. Just look where you are OneSG- in the pantry polishing the silver!
Need I say more? I did warn you not to get too puffed up. Now look where it has gotten you.

[OneSG]

NOOOORMAAAAN.!!! Whats happening? Come back quick. They are revolting. Look at them sassing me.

[LadyM]

See, there you are OneSG. Left on your own and to your own devices, you are becoming flustered and yelling for help. What was this about letting a man do my thinking? What WILL the ladies think?

[LadyM]

Snowden

Thanks for the concern. The ears are quite normal really. Tis himself with the conical head whose features need a bit of recycling, I fear. But lets say nothing to the dear boy, he is in such a stew already.

[Snowden]

Yes, LadyM, I can see he's in a bit of a stew. Oh dear - he's even forgotten Norman has his trainee on a vacation in Mexico! He wont be back for several days yet.

I wonder what Norman will say when he comes back to an emancipated group of trainees!

LadyM, I must admit to having flirted a bit with OneSG - wiggled the ol' eyebrows, batted the big brown eyes. The man is simply impervious to feminine wiles. Or is it because you keep him polishing the silver?

Mine needs polishing too - I wrapped it in plastic wrap and hid it. Maybe - could you lend me your polisher for a bit? I'd love to have my silver all shiney again. :p

[DocDiggs]

I grew up in what at the time was a rather smallish town some 25 miles W. of Chicago. It had the original brick streets downtown that were some 3 feet below sidewalk level to allow folks on horses or in wagons or carriages to step directly from their conveyance to the sidewalk in the pre-brick era. When I was a kid of 9 or so, I delivered the local paper to the various store owners and businessmen. One of my customers was Judge Herrick, a man of indeterminant age, but definitely very old, with long, thick snowy white hair, rumpled white cotton shirts, and wide suspenders that kept him respectable while wearing his typically baggy pants. He was always adorned with a hand tied bow tie which generally tilted off at an angle. He could easily have passed as a brother of Carl Sandburg, also an Illinois boy, whom he actually knew as a friend.

The Judge was long retired, but maintained his Justice of the Peace office of several decades in the two story Gary, Wheaton Bank building where he carried on some of the lesser legal business of the old Circuit. He knew my dad, a pharmacist on the far side of town and always inquired after my parents when I took his paper up to him. It seems that in looking back to that time, that he knew everyone in town. On his way home in the afternoon it was not unusual for him to purchase a handmade kitchen broom from the blind man who sold them in front of the bank. I suspect that the Judge had some dozens of those brooms.

I believe that The Judge was the Poet Laureate of Illinois, and I recall the legal size writing pads on his desk, half full, a quarter full, but never totally full or empty. He often talked of poetry or writing generally and one day, with a twinkle in his eyes, he asked me if I were a good lover. Not quite understanding his question, I stammered some nonsense response. Then he laughed and told me that the reason he wrote so much poetry, aside from the fact that he loved doing it, was because an old friend from days long gone, had once told him that poets made the best lovers! He chuckled and then added, "I've been scratching out poetry like crazy ever since."

Keep writing the rhyme, One SG!

;)

[OneSG]

Doc do not believe the man. One does not "scratch out poetry". Otherwise he may be truthful. Hmmm.

[Snowden]

DocDiggs, we know and enjoy the poetry of OneSG and many others here in Overfifties.

You tantalize us! Do you write poetry? Ummmmmm?

OneSG, you may have a rival in one of these categories! Or both.

I am glad to be my old flirtatious, emancipated self. You may never find me back in school, OneSG - except to flirt and tease. Ah, life is gooood! and fun.

[DocDiggs]

Sno,

Roses are red,
Violettes are blue,
OneSG's the poet,
How 'bout you?

I'm afraid my writing has been pretty much restricted to research writing and an occasional short story as a student in a creative writing class. i'd love to be able to write a Ludlum style best seller, but it jus' ain' goinna hap'n.
:confused:

[OneSG]

Secret Love

I have some words wrote on my heart, etched where no one can see.
No one must know what they do say, no one, save only me.
They tell how I love someone, someone that I should not.
She is already taken but I love her a lot.
What should I do, do tell me, I can’t rub those words out.
I have a secret yearning that I can’t shout about.
The tears on my pillow show how much I care.
I have a secret love, a love I cannot share.
Each time I see my loved one my heart just leaps for joy.
I need to tell my heart she has another boy.
What can I do please tell me, whatever can I do?
What can I do please tell me, the one I love is you.

[Snowden]

Doc, I always loved roses and violets! *G* That's poetry that I can dig, babe. LOL Only, for me - yellow roses are the loveliest.

OneSG, your poem is lovely. I enjoy teasing with my old friend here - he's a buddy.

[DocDiggs]

OneSG...

Marvelous. I could have borrowed this from you about 45 years ago.... I know whereof thou speakest.

[Joyous]

No battle here One-SG! I marvel at your ability to reach within and bring out such beauty. It truly is a beautiful poem.

[LadyM]

Snowden,
Of course, my dear, you may have the loan of the polisher. Please keep him for however long you like.
As for the flirting, Snowden, that is something that I have forgotten how to do, so best leave it to you.

And SG, enjoyed funning around with you. You gave me a few good laughs. To laugh with someone, to laugh at yourself is good for the soul. Hope that you enjoyed a giggle or two.

[Snowden]

LadyM, thanks for the silver polisher - he's doing a lovely job of it. Actually, he's teaching me how to do a better job, so while I am very slow at learning these indoor tasks, the silver is becoming something to take great joy in seeing once more on the sideboard.

I do hope you will stick around. Somehow I read in your last message above that you may not really be the mother-in-law he has told us about, but as good a leg-puller as he is.

It's a joy having you with us. ;)

[Joyous]

One-SG, a leg puller? Surely thou jest, Snowden! :D

[Snowden]

Now, Joyous - would I jest about a thing like that???!! :confused:

Moi?

[Shar]

I just don't know if I can bear to post this morning. I couldn't post last evening because after spending hours of reading what Lady M posted, I was just so disillusioned.!! I thought, did I start this trend with my concerns that we were all being (perhaps) phased out for new recruits? Then, I thought, no, that could have been a VERY SMALL part of it but then I thought, was it because Norman abandoned ONE and left him alone trying to keep us in our place? Was it because Lady M blew ONE's cover? Could be. It is not easy to have respect for a silver polisher that leaves spots!!

I have been on my knees praying this morning, trying to find an answer to this. NADA, nothing!!. I even lit a few candles and I am not even Catholic. All they did was catch the small curtain on fire that was too near the tabletop. Then, I read the "threat" of COLDITZ.(post of 3/6/03) ..Really now, that does not follow the statements of ONE and Norman that they are training with kindness.

Even sweetheart is balking at the program, and she is fairly new. Tori has evidently left with not one tear nor even looking back. Her trainer assistant is completely taking over. Snowdens assistant trainer is apparently doing the same thing. (and if I know Bob, he never liked her messing around with that car anyway!) Joyous is trying to hold on but I think being a little under the weather, she won't last very long either. Really, she was coming along quite nicely too.! And, for ONE to even use such underhanded tactics as to allude that Lady M is somewhat similar in looks to Dr. Spock, is such an ungentlemanly thing to say. I have lost much respect for him there. I now am wondering if she lost an ear. It could have been a ploy to scare us! I see where Doc Diggs tried to come in and give ONE support by taking our minds off of this horrible mess that is piling up. It won't work Doc, but the writing was EXCELLENT!!

I don't know, praying is okay, but this could take staying on your knees until you have callouses. If I have to go back to that stage one thing of chewing hides....well...absolutely refuse to take a chance on harming these new crowns.! Also, summer is coming on and the firewood is sliding down to the pool so no more of that chopping stuff either. Gene says that surely, this entire program is not organized. Even MY trainer assistant is balking.

I say, get the grandson in on this act. What you say Lady M? I suspect he would have many good ideas ..probably one would be where we could send old trainers that have lost control and need to be re-programmed...............I will check in often to see if anything, I mean anything...can be salvaged.

[LadyM]

Hi there Shar

If the grandson is a technical engineer and an expert programmer then I think your idea is a sound one. These trainers definitely need to be sent back to the shop to be re-programmed. I, for one, suspect that there is some faulty circuitry that needs immediate repair.

And please don't comcern yourself about the reference to my pointed ears. They are, after all, an indication that I have achieved a quite clear, unemotional, and logical state of mind

[Joyous]

LadyM, i think the pointy ears show that you are listening and a good listener is an intelligent person.

I must say there is much to to be said for a good silver polisher. Let us not cast aspersions at the ability to put a shine on sterling.

Shar, I feel so much better now and I am casting about in the recesses of my brain to decide whether or not I wish to be trained. There are pluses to being spoiled. Yet should I forego the progress I was making in the stage 3? Or was it stage 2? Hmmmmm?

Norman will be so disappointed when he returns to find all his work for naught. And what of our own dear One-SG? He will lose face if we abandon the program completely. I would be perplexed beyond the telling if that happened. HMMMMM?:confused:

[norman]

Seems like I have a lot of reading to do to catch up. I think I better take time to do that 1st.

[Snowden]

Shar, you're right about Bob - he saw that Norman was watching us and saw him standing there with my nice clean clothes in his hands, and - well, it was hard for me to convince him after that that this was for his benefit. He growled that it seemed to be benefitting the trainers in ways he did not approve.

He's very Victorian, you know. That's part of the fun of being with him - easy to shock, and that's always good for a chuckle. ;)

Joyous, I think OneSG can roll with it. He seems to have a great sense of humor - humour, that is. He won't give up - and I doubt very much that Norman will either. They'll just find something else to offer courses in. Painting? (Art, not houses.)

We'll see. I'm sure something will be offered!

[norman]

Snowden how about a really short course in written language skills. A Japonese Proverb should be a nice start.

[Snowden]

Norman - is "really" really spelled "realy" in Japanese?

I love the proverb - :D

Of course, I think I'll pass on that course. What else can you come up with?

[norman]

Snowden I'll have to think about another area but for now I'm 100% sure prayer is not going to be an area that all you women need training in. I overheard this and being exceptionally swift could immediately imagine how Bob, Dutch, Himself, & Gene would react if they heard any of you reciting it.



PRAYER FOR WOMAN

Dear Lord I pray

For wisdom to understand my man

Love to forgive him

Patience for his moods

Because Lord if I pray for Strength

I'll beat him to death

[Snowden]

Oh, dear - and I thought I was praying so softly. Well, what can I say? :confused:

Sometimes one must pray for self-control. We were all getting too strong and it was a worry to the men. *G*

[Joyous]

Norman, you are SO attuned to the female psyche.

Snowden, I also thought I had prayed quietly, but it seems someone is listening and I don't mean God!

I am quite relieved to be finished with the training course. I felt so inferior, and thats not good. I probably would never have reached Mary Poppins phase anyway. :D

[Shar]

Ah Norman, the Cancun trip was good for you. Eveidently you and your personal trainee became very close while you were gone..:D

Really, I don't think any of us would have done well with the Phase 4 Mary Poppins one. I can't carry a tune and I can imagine Gene getting into the stash of duct tape that we are saving in case of a terrorist germ warfare attack and taping my mouth shut as soon as I burst into song. You know Mary sang about every other sentence. Also, magically, a full orchestra accompanied her, Course, he is a little hard of hearing and he might not notice that.

Also, ONE and NORMAN just might shove all of those kids at us as one of the requirements of phase 4. How many did she marry into????Whatever, it was a BUNCH.! I would have flunked that phase in about 15 minutes!! I treated grandkids like rent cars and turned them in after so many miles.! Poor Mary had to keep them busy singing and galloping over the hills just to keep them occupied.

I had much rather sit down and read:

[Snowden]

Well, Shar, I can carry a tune and used to sing a lot. But, as time goes by I find my voice just isn't improving. I feel sorry for the people in front of me in church, but I struggle through the hymns and responses. Catholic hymns are a mixed bag; some, those mostly garnered from the Episcopal and other protestant churches are great. Others! I don't always try with them.

My husband has one of the most beautiful baritone voices I've ever heard - he has always received compliments from those around us in church. Our sons inherited this, and it's a delight to me to hear them sing. Now comes Paddy - at nearly four, he sings most of the day, makes up songs or sings those his parents have sung to him. It's fun listening to a small one sing - whether or not the tune is perfect.

Paddy is my seventh grandchild - and the first I've spent much time with. I took care of four of them twice, those of my middle son. In both cases it was because of an emergency. I told them if they want me to take care of the children, first discipline them. It's not my job. I take care of Paddy for a while on Mondays, and he knows he minds me. We get along fine. Usually.

[Tori]

It's a good thing Norman wasn't around when I read the Japanese proverb; he would have winessed me blushing with embarrasment!

The Mary Poppins phase is definately out for me. I'm just not too sure about the singing thing!

When I'm driving down the road all by myself, windows rolled up and the air conditioner going full blast, belting out songs along with the car radio; I often wonder why I didn't go for a career as a vocalist!

Then when I'm in church, joyfully adding my voice in praise and worship and my whole family turns and glares at me as one; I know why!

[Joyous]

Tori, where is your picture? I loved seeing your smiling face. Post the one that your guy carried around in his wallet.

I used to sing and was told I had a good voice, but that was then. This is now. I love to sing, but time has a way of putting creaks in the voice. Can't reach the highs any more. However, like Tori, I still sing in the car, or in the shower. Then I am a great vocalist.

:D I remember as a teenager, I would go off some place in the woods and sing my heart out. In my mind I was standing before an appreciative audience, taking bows, having flowers thrown before my feet. (Chuckle)

[Tori]

Joyous I removed it when I copied all the Shipwrecked posts over from the old board. My picture was on every post and gave the impression that I was hogging the board. I'll try putting it back now that everyone is familiar with the topic being in the new discussions.

[Snowden]

Tori, I'm just lucky that none of my family go to the same church I attend. The people in front of us do look back from time to time, but I don't have to tell them anything.

I just make my joyful voice to the Lord and try to sound as I did 20 - even five! - years ago. But, give me a bucket and I can carry the tune!

[DocDiggs]

Thanks, Shar....

Got a good Yuckle outta the chick cartoon. I was SURE I had sensed an unlying heavy breathing in this run of posts. The last couple frames of the chick cartoon suggest that there's still a lotta life out there! yuckle, yuckle.....

;)

[Snowden]

Well, Doc - heavy breathing is good for us, isn't it? ;)

At least it makes life more interesting, and a lot more fun!

[Christmas]

Not sure about this. One day it works another it doesn't.
When it does work I forgot what I did.
When it doesn't work I am at a loss.

So the situation now is HANGING, just hanging out here.
The poor old discussion board has problems again.
I wonder if we called terminix it would help matters.

Well if I get lost I am going to ASKJEEVES and see what he says.

:D flavorite China man

[Joyous]

Snowden, I love the house-mice. Thats how the sexes are supposed to behave! Nose rubbing to cozy each other up. I recall as a child, if we siblings got into a tussle, we were made to rub noses. How could you stay angry at someone who was standing there, rubbing your nose with their's?

Nice to be spoiled again after the hassle of trying to be trained. I appreciate the old ways even more now. :D

[Shar]

Well, I have reached the conclusion that we are trained..!!!. Else, why would all orders/suggestions cease? In the process of training us, I firmily believe that Norman and One SG picked up a little trining themseves. By osmosis I presume. So, here we are..more understanding of our mates, more eager to do manual labor and the men are slacking off on wanting us to do all that manual labor and are so happy with us that they are helping with the chores that were once assigned to us. What a great thing came out of this. I think I will go shopping and buy a new dress. I am just.....so happy!

[OneSG]

I am sorry you feel neglected. I am so busy here shouting instructions to a wife and mother in-law, as well as looking after over 300 ferrets, that I really have not had the time to instruct you in the arts of enjoying life as it was meant to be. I do hope in your disillusionment that you do not slip into slovenly ways again. You have all seen the benefits of regaining the woman’s role. I hope you will continue striving for perfection. There are still areas we have not touched on which will enhance the husband/wife relationship. The joys that can be had by a woman from massaging her man are without a doubt without equal. Even if you are not an expert in the art, I feel confident your man will understand and allow you to practice on him.
The mother in-law fell off the roof again and I am busy helping her to do her chores until the break mends. It is hard to chop wood with an arm in plaster. With only one cart in use now the money will be e little tight. Perhaps I can sell some of the ferrets.
You all started off so well but it was inevitable you would all resort to your former lazy lifestyle. It was too much to believe we could have a world full of women doing as they all should! This would be, after all, utopia.

[Snowden]

Well now, OneSG, let's look at this situation from a mature point of view.

The idea is that we want to make our husbands, our mates, happy, right? The massages are the one thing I believe all our mates really enjoy. They seem also to thoroughly enjoy returning the favor. So massages seem to be the one really outstanding and successful lesson we've all learned for making these mates happy.

Hey - don't knock it! These men love us; they saw how much we loved them, in that we all literally threw ourselves into learning how to make their lives better in every way. Now the one thing that makes them happiest is doing the same for us.

OneSG and Norman - the program was a complete success. In the long run, certainly. ;)

Go ahead and sell the ferrets. That's why you have them. Let your mother-in-law go to the beach and relax! And thank you both for a wonderful ending - or pause, as the case may be.

[OneSG]

It is amazing to see how the balance of power alters. The balance of power , not between nations but between the sexes.
In our youth the women have something the boys want. The women know this and do all that they can to see how many hoops they can get the male to jump through. The awestruck youths proceed to jump eagerly from hoop to hoop.
Youth quickly passes to adult and young man hood. The balance of power shifts. There is an equal desire. Each has what the other wants. No game playing now. No hoop jumping just pure enjoyment. If only the female had been so willing to dispel with the games those years ago when the hormones were raging.
Age creeps up on us all. Middle age. Now the balance of power is in the gents favour. The male has what the woman wants. If only I had understood the shift of power when I could handle it. Those years have been wasted with me unaware of the possibilities open to the power dominant gender.

[Shar]

Oh ONE, your post brought tears to my eyes. I cannot bear to see you so down. I have found 4 people that want a ferret. They have hper-active children and think the two..(ferret and child) will wear each other down. I have been passing along all information to one wife and she is estatic that now, she will have a way to keep the hyper-active child amused and concentrate on "her man". So, inadvertently, you have speard your knowlege across the sea. You should be quite proud.,,!!

She asked me to tell you that she does not remember the sequence of events that you described though. I must tell you ONE, that I think it is because she may have the beginning of Alzheimer's. Therefore I printed out all past instructions and have clipped them to the refrigerator. She seldom goes near the stove so that was out, and also she could have accidently burned them. From the looks of her weight, I believe she will find them on the refrigerator.

[OneSG]

I have an animal I at first thought was a ferret. It transpired that in my inexperienced innocence I had mistaken a weasel for a ferret. I should have realised this when it turned up in a blue, white and red striped box. It cowers in the corner afraid of every other creature around him. He is impotent. So, Shar, I have what appears to be a French impotent weasel one of your ladies can have for free as it is good for nothing.

[Snowden]

Well, OneSG, what a terrible disappointment for you! Shar is right - you are teaching at long distance, and not even on the TV!

The child won't mind the weasel being impotent - doesn't know that word anyway and would have only the one pet. So that problem is solved as well.

Isn't it wonderful having such a community spirit?

And all I could come up with is a vole.

[Shar]

ah me, it appears the battle between the sexes has been put on hold because of a larger battle going on between nations.

They have given up on us ladies. I believe that is what ONE is suggesting. OR, could it be that we reached a better level of learning and they adjusted their training expectations? WE are more considerate, they are more accepting...and on and on..My, what a nice level to be. ..sort of like a hammock on an island, sipping a refreshing drink and just looking at the sky or sea.

I do hope ONE gets rid of that weasel though. I think it could become more of a pest over time.

Now, I think we still have small battles (or skrimishes) daily. I am trying to get rid of things so we could move, and most definitely before we leave on our trip. Gene "forgot" to get rid of some things before I came here and I have left them and tried to make everything fit. A real job I will tell you. Sooooooo, he kept saying, now, I am going to move my huge desk and storage cabinet from the office and I really meant to get rid of that regular size bed that must have been manufctured by Genghis Khan. WE have 2 kings and a queen size upstairs and really will need it to go later anyway. This didn't happen for 7 months, so when his daughter said a friend of hers needed a bed, did not have the money, would we loan it to him? I said yes, with the stipulation it is for 3 months to give him time to buy one. (I figured GEne would give it to him later, but didn't make that decision until he was consulted) Same thing about a huge round table & 6 captain chairs in the den. WE have a large dining table and a glass top kitchen table..he just forgot to get rid of the other before I came. SO..I "loaned" that one also with the option that he could buy it in 3 months..or sooner. GOOD GOSH

all of a sudden, those items became treasured keepsakes!! (Remember, while crying almost, I got rid of over 3/4 of my things before I moved) Finally, after the things were gone..Gene says.......you know that bed was really cheap. Was like sleeping on a sack of coal. We probably will give it to that guy but you are right in that we should do it later as people should feel they earned something. The table he made..and it was a good one..the captain chairs we both would love to keep, but how many tables can you do something with unless you suspend them from the ceiling and lower them up and down when needed?

So, I am sure I am not the only one with the daily little battles...and really, I thought that getting married in your 60's all of those would not show up. WRONG, they do..So, I am sure we will still have much to talk about in this



Battle Between The Sexes

[Christmas]

I wouldn't take a million for the man I have managed to potty train although it took 40 years for his lessons to sink in.

Greenjeans tells me I would make a good drill instructor and then says but I don't think I would be alive today if it weren't for you.
I think living with a man is a battle of the wits. He is stronger in some areas and I am in others. Take two pieces and put them together and you get one whole. But I have to say this as well, the older I get the more I want it "my way".

It was ingrained in me as a child to always be fair and to see the others side of a matter before making decisions. It is so deep that it keeps me from being a complete tirant (sp).

Shar, I was told once back in B. B. (before Bobby) that take a man and put him in a sack with all the other men....shake real good and dump them out and they will all fall at the same time at the same speed. In other words they are all alike, "G". Well, they can't be entirely alike but with the same basics.

Are we like that Shar? I am not as objective with women.
I do know that a bad woman is a devil. Devil or angel, remember that song. We are a complex rubics cube.

I plan on keeping greenjeans ....I just can't get him to leave.
Everytime he asks for a divorce, I say fine pick a lawyer get the papers drawn up and split EVERYTHING in half and I will leave.
But, you are fortunate I am so fair because I really deserve it ALL. He then responds...."Well, in that case I will stay a little longer"!

[norman]

A friend of mine sent me this & I thought it would show why I've had a compassionate streak lately. I'm yelling a lot less now.

Hey Norman

It is important for men to remember that as women grow older it becomes harder for them to maintain the same quality of housekeeping as they did when they were younger. When men notice this, they should try not to yell.

Let me relate how I handle the situation. When I got laid off from my bookbinding job and took "early retirement" in January, it became necessary for Mary to get a full-time job, both for extra income and for health benefits that we need. She was a trained medical transcriptionist when we met twenty-eight years ago and was fortunate to land a job at a local transcription house. It was shortly after she started working at this job that I noticed that she was beginning to show her age.

I usually get home from fishing or hunting about the same time she gets home from work. Although she knows how hungry I am, she almost always says that she has to rest for half an hour or so before she starts supper. I try not to yell at her when this happens. Instead, I tell her to take her time. I understand that she is not as young as she used to be. I just tell her to wake me when she finally does get supper on the table.

She used to wash and dry the dishes as soon as we finished eating. It is now not unusual for them to sit on the table for several hours after supper. I do what I can by reminding her several times each evening that they aren't cleaning themselves. I know she appreciates this, as it does seem to help her get them done before she goes to bed.

Our washer and dryer are in the basement. When she was younger, Mary used to be able to go up and down the stairs all day and not get tired. Now that she is older she seems to get tired so much more quickly. Sometimes she says she just can't make another trip down those steps. I don't make a big issue of this. As long as she finishes up the laundry the next evening I am willing to overlook it. Not only that, but unless I need something ironed to wear to the Monday lodge meeting or to Wednesday's or Saturday's poker club or to Tuesday's or Thursday's bowling or something like that, I will tell her to wait until the next evening to do the ironing. This gives her little more time to do some of those odds and ends things like shampooing the dog, vacuuming or dusting. Also, if I have had a really good day fishing, this allows her to gut and scale the fish at a more leisurely pace.

Mary is starting to complain a little occasionally. Not often, mind you, but just enough for me to notice. For example, she will say that it is difficult for her to find time to pay the monthly bills during her lunch hour. In spite of her complaining, I continue to try to offer encouragement. I tell her to stretch it out over two or even three days. That way she won't have to rush so much. I also remind her that missing lunch completely now and then wouldn't hurt her any, if you know what I mean.

When doing simple jobs she seems to think she needs more rest periods than she used to have to take.

A couple of weeks ago she said she had to take a break when she was only half finished mowing the yard. I overlook comments like these because I realize it's just age talking. In fact, I try not to embarrass her when she needs these little extra rest breaks. I tell her to fix herself a nice, big, cold glass of freshly squeezed lemonade and just sit for a while. I tell her that as long as she is making one for herself, she may as well make one for me and take her break by the hammock so she can talk with me until I fall asleep. I could go on and on, but I think you know where I'm coming from.

I know that I probably look like a saint in the way I support Mary on a daily basis. I'm not saying that the ability to show this much consideration is easy.

No one knows better than I do how frustrating women can become as they get older. My purpose in writing this is simply to suggest that you make the effort. I realize that achieving the exemplary level of showing consideration I have attained is out of reach for the average man, but I'm sure you will pay attention Norman & try to match my efforts.

However, Norman, even if you just yell at your wife a little less often because of this email, I will consider that writing this was worthwhile.

Your Old Buddy
Bob

[OneSG]

Norman. Your friend Bob seems to be a nice, kind, considerate man. His wife must be proud to have such a man as her husband. I must try and be more helpful too. I wonder, though, if he had his inlaw there as I do he would be as long suffering.

[Christmas]

HAVING READ your post Norman, I have found my calling.

I am making arrangements with my financial manager to start a "drill instructor" academy.

I see there is a definite need for that service.

I am starting a website letting the female population know my intentions. I know it is going to take a mint to provide an academy as large as will be needed. It is possible I will sell franchises.

Now, maybe someone will suggest a name for my academy.

[Snowden]

Norman, are you sure that letter was from Bob? Not OneSG? I dunno - has a very familiar ring to it.......

[norman]

Nothing exotic in this as a name

Christmas's Camp


Where you will learn -- You shouldn't go through life with a
catcher's mitt on both hands. You need to be able to throw
something back.

Christmas I'm only guessing that in your camp, you want to teach women how to be more assertive, yet remain feminine.

I don't think a symbol of graduation like a Christmas tree shaped like a bull horn would go over very well. I'm not to keen on the idea of a Christmas tree that converts into a whip either. What would a symbol of graduation look like?

[Snowden]

Christmas, if Norman has the right aspect on this, may I make a suggestion as to the symbol of graduation?

I suggest a Wonder Bra. :D

[Christmas]

Snow!!!! what a wonderful idea.

Wonder bras are a feminine apparatus with a supporting under wire, right?

Norman, woman is a many splendered thing!!!

She can sneak up on you and get you to do what you don't want to do and make you like it!!!

My academy will teach women how to be both strong and "able".

In ac -shu- al- i -tee......I just have to do "something" about my spelling.......woman was made to help man keep on the right track from behind the scenes.

Greenjeans has certainly come round to a polished diamond.

I will have to "think" as to the name. Can you hear the rusty wheel turrrrrrning, turrrrrning.....screak, squake, screeeeek.

[Joyous]

Christmas, count me out if the bra is underwired! I have never nor will I ever wear those things. They are terribly uncomfortable and it has been said they contribute to breast cancer.

Now I would like a bra that up-lifts, but offers comfort. It should have wide, soft straps so they do not cut into my shoulders. The cups should be shaped to one's form. Not too pointy as most mature breasts are certainly not pointy.

What else does your "school" offer? Will you have a class in memory? That seems to be my largest problem at present.

Christmas, what on earth would Greenjeans do without you?:D

[norman]

If this thread continues I will monitor it for input. If a business venture can be started then I too should be able to start one; using counter measures about items I learn here.

I checked the color chart for text and didn't see grey as a choice. So any of you that was considering whispering using grey colored text so I wouldn't know anything can just forget that idea.

[Snowden]

Christmas, I don't know about an underwire - wouldn't like that a bit! I'd have to agree with Joyous about that - but we would be applying for jobs as teachers, I believe. Just to be helpful, you know.

Would you have certain tests and/or standards we would have to meet?

Norman, watch that! - Come to think of it, that's what you had in mind, isn't it. Yes, I do believe the name "Rascal" is very appropriate for you. Check the input indeed! ;)

[Joyous]

Since the group has been lost on an island, there seems to be no battle between the sexes. Maybe getting back to nature has it's rewards. Everyone so busy creating shelter, finding food, and inventing stuff, no battles. Something to be said for bare necessities? :cool:

One thing remains the same.
THE RASCAL!

[Shar]

This forum has 5 pages. I know because I read all of them this morning. I have activated it because I see that ONE SG is making noises in another forum . I would guess, trying to get the training program started again.!!!

LADIES, please take time out from your normal daily living and read from the beginning. We MUST NOT revert back to phase one again. Now, since we not only have 2 horses, as opposed to the 1 that Gene talked about, I really don't have time for FERRET breeding, raising, feeding, etc. Even Gene is opposed to that one as he says they would make the horses nervous. Such a kind man to think of the horses welfare!!

I am soooooooooooo glad we have some new ladies coming in as I think if ONE SG starts this program again (or one equally as demanding) we will need their input. We, ladies, may have been "whipped down" and will definitely need their strength to be able to go to that phase 4 called Mary Poppins....I do hope the new gentlemen posters will not be contaminated by this program idea. Surely not, they appear to be so sensible don't you think?

Losing Snowden and Edith....and Tori so busy right now may leave us at a disadvantage.

But, me thinks I may need a little nonsense in my life right now..

So, be forewarned....I do think ONE SG is hatching a little plot by activating this training program (or at least talking about it) in another forum and intends on gaining strength and, perhaps, more men trainers and more ....pitiful...partly submissive.....ferret loving women back into his lair and bringing them over here..................sigh......(shoot, there I go sighing again)

I do think..this is what is happening and I see............a monkey in the woodpile.

[Joyous]

Shar, thanks for the warning. I recall those dire days when One-SG and Norman had us in their clutches. Ferrets indeed! My plan is already made to take a hike. One male will not be in on their little plot. George has agreed to mountain climb with myself, Perena-Red, and all those who wish to accompany us. I had hoped you would join us along with Gene as this is to be a co-ed climb. Our plan is to win the Polident contest and instead of a cruise, we will hopefully get Polident to pay for our gear, food, etc to climd mountains.

Now I do not have in mind Mt. Everest, not the even Mt. St. Helen. Just a few small mountains-hills actually-maybe a 4000 foot mountain. I do not see One-SG traipsing up a mountain to force females to ferret farm.:D

[Shar]

Ha Joyous, with only one leg, one arm and one eye..........you can bet he will feign computer problems and pretend he cannot find the invitation for the hike.!!

If you recall, I was unjustly blamed for causing an uprising among the ladies and it took me forever to get an apology for such a terrible accusation. After all Joyous, I did whisper it to the women and we all know those men had us bugged somehow and heard it. ..HUMPH!

Put my name down for the Polident hike please.

[Joyous]

Ha Joyous, with only one leg, one arm and one eye..........you can bet he will feign computer problems and pretend he cannot find the invitation for the hike.!!

If you recall, I was unjustly blamed for causing an uprising among the ladies and it took me forever to get an apology for such a terrible accusation. After all Joyous, I did whisper it to the women and we all know those men had us bugged somehow and heard it. ..HUMPH!

Put my name down for the Polident hike please.

[B]Goodness, we sure lost a lot of hikers way back when! No body wants to have adventures anymore do they Shar? You and [I would have climbed Mt. Everest if we had others along. Okay, I am exaggerating, but at least a small mountain!

[Shar]

It may not be easy Joyous, just 2 people treking around by themselves finding new exciting places. At one time, if I recall, each person took us on a trip to their country. I propose we go looking for this one Joyous..(dictionary definition)

Shangri-La is a fictional place described in the novel, Lost Horizon, written by British writer James Hilton in 1933. In it, "Shangri-La" is a mystical, harmonious valley, gently guided from a lamasery, enclosed in the western end of the Himalaya. Shangri-La has become synonymous with any earthly paradise but particularly a mythical Himalayan utopia — a permanently happy land, isolated from the outside world. The word also evokes the imagery of exoticism of the Orient. The story of Shangri-La is based on the concept of Shambhala, a mystical city in the Buddhist religion.

Several possible places in the Buddhist Himalaya between north India and Tibet have been suggested as the actual basis for Hilton's legend
************************************************** ******
How about it? What should we pack and in what city should be meet? I will have to dig out my world map to see what is between North India and Tibet. And that Shambhala, well, I never heard of that so I will go searching for that one. Definitely we should take a warm coat..*G* But, also, shorts, levi's and T shirts because it will probably be warm when we get there. Maybe there is a way station along the way to shed the cold weather gear and keep the warm weather clothing? Sure will take a load off Joyous!!

Give me a little time as we are getting ready for the Easter celebrations, but I will work on it in my spare time..I guess we could watch the movie about it but somehow jumping from Gene Kelly dancing after he got there and the other one that had ...was it Brad Pitt?....shows they are just guessing. I think we should find the "real" one...Maybe that also will get a few people interested that might want to join us.

Have a happy day.

[eye-1]

Would`nt it be good if discussions were fun like this still! Ah! The good old days!

[Shar]

eye-1, what a nice thing you did by activating this thread !! I spent over an hour yesterday reading from page 1. You were correct, it was soooooooo full of fun and no one posting to pull apart posts and attack anyone. There are some good topics on the board today I notice and they have the same air about them as this one. I know you must have spent much time reading the old boards to find the ones you have activated.

Here is a HUGE HUG from me for bringing this one back to read. It also may help some posters now to know a little about some of us longer time posters.

Your prize today because you are

[Snowden]

Yes, it was fun, wasn't it. I don't mind the debates, though -- it's sneering, snide remarks that will make a site unpleasant to visit. Some just can't ignore that, and some really get hurt by it. Hurting people isn't necessary, but if a site won't engage moderators to "keep the peace," then the next best thing is for posters to put the unpleasant ones on ignore.

It wouldn't work for me though. I'm afraid I'll miss something! ;)

[Uncle Fred]

Like Uncle Fred's pearls of wisdom ?

The latest atrocities of the USA, not reported in Yank media ?

Recent scholarship casting even MORE doubt on Christian origins ?

Latest studies on the devastation of native fauna by domestic and feral cats ?





Yep, one could miss heaps.
.

[Snowden]

Like Uncle Fred's pearls of wisdom ?

The latest atrocities of the USA, not reported in Yank media ?

Recent scholarship casting even MORE doubt on Christian origins ?

Latest studies on the devastation of native fauna by domestic and feral cats ?





Yep, one could miss heaps.
.

Only if any of that claptrap were real, Keith -- which it is not. So, in answer to your question, no, none of that. A pearl of great value, yes; but Keith, mon ami, we have yet to have you produce one! :D

Well, I do admit feral cats can do a bit of damage; that's why we make domestic pets of them. They make great pets and become domesticated, thus doing away with the feral part.


You do describe perfectly "Uncle Fred's pearls of great mediocrity" though.

[Uncle Fred]

......feral cats can do a bit of damage; that's why we make domestic pets of them.
They make great pets and BECOME DOMESTICATED (?), thus DOING AWAY (?) with the feral part.
The sort of cat we're talking about is not native to America or Australia.
Hence ALL feral cats are the progeny of domestic cats introduced by the ill-informed and those who knew nothing or cared nothing for native fauna.

No domestic cats = no feral cats.
Most frequently, they result from people dumping unwanted litters.

I really like the "BECOME DOMESTICATED" line.
I'd like to see anyone 'domesticate' a full-grown feral cat. It would rip your arms off.
They are savage predatorial beasts which wreak havoc on native birds, reptiles and little furry creatures - some to the point of extinction.

As you consult authoritative sources to further your awareness of this subject, you will no doubt find that domestic cats and their feral progeny are considered responsible for the maiming, torturing and death of BILLIONS of "God's creatures" worldwide each year.

Should I start now on Yanks and Fundie Christians .......... or WOMEN ?

[Snowden]

The sort of cat we're talking about is not native to America or Australia.
Hence ALL feral cats are the progeny of domestic cats introduced by the ill-informed and those who knew nothing or cared nothing for native fauna.

No domestic cats = no feral cats.
Most frequently, they result from people dumping unwanted litters.

I really like the "BECOME DOMESTICATED" line.
I'd like to see anyone 'domesticate' a full-grown feral cat. It would rip your arms off.
They are savage predatorial beasts which wreak havoc on native birds, reptiles and little furry creatures - some to the point of extinction.

Now don't get your knickers in a knot, Keithie. There's no reason for your cats to be all that feral if they had been gathered up as kittens and treated like pets. After all, they are all from Africa, even as you and I -- and all other human beings. And Australia was the first continent to break off from Africa, so your feral cats and our cats are the same basic stock.

The difference is that we use cats in two categories; to keep down the rodent population and as pets. They perform well in both categories; they are mammals and are loving pets. It's symbiotic; works well for us.

As you consult authoritative sources to further your awareness of this subject, you will no doubt find that domestic cats and their feral progeny are considered responsible for the maiming, torturing and death of BILLIONS of "God's creatures" worldwide each year.

Should I start now on Yanks and Fundie Christians .......... or WOMEN ?

Oh, I know that. The thing is that it's because they have not been tames as the cats in the US, Canada and Europe have done. They are smaller than tigers, etc., and they still have to eat. They manage; they are beasts, after all. Savage and predatorial? Of course; if you and those you love were hungry and all you had were claws and teeth, you'd be savage and predatorial also.

Come to think of it, they really have a good reason for being as they are.

So, Keith, what's your reason? Is it that you have such an inferiority complex that you must be insulting to others to feel like you are worthwhile? There has to be a reason for the unreasonable amount of vinegar in your blood. Why so sour, ol' friend? Why are you always saying nothing good about anybody but yourself? Definitely a sign of an inferiority complex.

You hate the Yanks, as you call us. Not really; you have a bee in your bonnet about what you think. You've never been here; you don't know us at all. Snarling at us on the internet is no introduction; we're no different than any other people. Some of us are very friendly and kind; others are like you. It's just human nature, Keith. People are much the same the world over. ;)

By the way, feral cats came before domesticated cats. If people will not take care of cats, they will darn well take care of themselves. That's true for all creatures great and small -- two legged or four legged.

[eye-1]

eye-1, what a nice thing you did by activating this thread !! I spent over an hour yesterday reading from page 1. You were correct, it was soooooooo full of fun and no one posting to pull apart posts and attack anyone. There are some good topics on the board today I notice and they have the same air about them as this one. I know you must have spent much time reading the old boards to find the ones you have activated.

Here is a HUGE HUG from me for bringing this one back to read. It also may help some posters now to know a little about some of us longer time posters.

Your prize today because you are
Oh! Thank you Shar! May be short lived but we can hope! Nothing wrong with a bit of true fun without sarcasm and snide remarks is there? Although seems to be heading down the same path as the rest, but we can hope to avoid unpleasantness just for a change, can`t we? I am an eternal optimist........

[eye-1]

Like Uncle Fred's pearls of wisdom ?

The latest atrocities of the USA, not reported in Yank media ?

Recent scholarship casting even MORE doubt on Christian origins ?

Latest studies on the devastation of native fauna by domestic and feral cats ?





Yep, one could miss heaps.
. Well, we can go to those threads and read them and keep them there and just have a place for those who just want to have a bit of fun! What do you say, Fred? There are SOME good things in life too if u look around.

[Uncle Fred]

....It's SNEERING, SNIDE REMARKS that will make a site unpleasant to visit.
Hurting PEOPLE isn't necessary .....

We were talking about feral CATS.
I made NO personal comment about anyone.
BUT ALL OF A SUDDEN we have .......... Now don't get your knickers in a knot, Keithie. ......
.....they are beasts, after all......they really have a good reason for being as they are.
So, Keith, what's your reason?
Is it that you have such an INFERIORITY COMPLEX that you must be INSULTING TO OTHERS to feel like you are WORTHWHILE?
There has to be a reason for the unreasonable amount of VINEGAR IN YOUR BLOOD.
Why so SOUR.....?
Why are you ALWAYS saying nothing good about anybody but YOURSELF ? Definitely a sign of an INFERIORITY COMPLEX.

You HATE the Yanks, as you call us. (???).......
SNARLING at us on the internet is no introduction...
Gee, I'm glad we don't have any of those "sneering snide remarks' hurting people in here !
.

[Joyous]

So, Snowden and Fred are at it again. Ringside seats anyone?
Go to your respective corners and come out swinging.

[Uncle Fred]

My goodness Joyous, to make it a fair and even contest I'd have to tie one hand behind my back !

However, she's already been disqualified for hitting below the belt in the very first round.
(Even then, I had to keep checking that I still had two ears).

[Black Bear]

So, Keith, what's your reason? Is it that you have such an inferiority complex that you must be insulting to others to feel like you are worthwhile? Quote Snowden.

I don't think I will ever argue with you again, Snowden, you hit the nail right on this head with this answer. To you , lady, I dips 'me lid.

[eye-1]

I am here in your beautiful Country, Australia, enjoying time with my beloved family, and I can`t imagine how people who live here can ever be unhappy or mean spirited when surrounded by such beauty! Do you not see it all around you and marvel at it every day and feel instantly happy when u wake up and see such beauty every day? I know I do when I am here. You truly can`t take this for granted and be grumpy, seriously, can u? I feel happy just waking up to the sound of your beautiful birds and that sets my mood for the day!Oh! How can u not feel happy living here? You have a beautiful Country! I so envy you living here and it being a part of your daily life! You don`t know how lucky u r! Wake up and smell the roses some times, and tell me life isn`t wonderful. Look around you and SEE the beauty in your own backyard - I dare you! *S*

[Black Bear]

By the way, feral cats came before domesticated cats (Snowden)

I am not arguing with you Snowden, just a bit of history of this country, Australia.

The feral cat here is most definitely from domestic pets gone astray. The fox was introduced by the HI HO! British to chase on weekends. The rabbit for some other reason, fearl camels by the Afghans, Feral Donkeys by whomever, feral pigs (three variities) by Asians who landed on these shores, stayed awhile and left. Water Buffalo introduced, but not a real big problem as it is collected and sent to Queensland for the football season, in pies, along with camels and donkeys. However eating donkeys, or asses, in Queensland is deemed to be some form of cannibalism????

Now we have feral deer, also introduced to this country a long time ago. They are a traffic hazard and fence destroyer in the Kempsey NSW forrest area, one place that has been prominent for this in the news.

Both feral and domestic cats destroy the small animals and birds, which are part of the food chain for other native animals, thus creating a gap in the suvival of native animals. It is all very well to say, people should be responsible for their animals, but they don't, and most are in denial about their moggie anyway.

There is a constant barrage at the borders, of ethnics trying to bring in food that is banned in this country. One day it will get through, as much does now, one would suspect and we may have a serious produce crop disease. To see the shows like "border Security" and see the Asians try to tell the customs agent that the mushrooms are not food or the pigs trotters are not meat and so on, is a bit scary when you think of the possible concequences.

The stuff is not declared and it is an obvious attempt to get contraband into Australia.

One old lebonese bloke and his wife had leaves that were full of beetles. "Not food" sez he "We make tea out of it, drink, not eat". fair enough! let 'em in. NOT.

[eye-1]

Well, it WAS very short lived after all! I give up!

[Auntie Freda]

He's right about the rotten ferals though Eye.
Particularly CATS !

[robertjohnfornengo]

Feral cats?...... Story time.

My older sister loved cats and birds.... She hated it when one of her cats killed a bird..... The only thing I could say to her was "Instinct, natural instinct"..... I didn't make her feel better, and I'm sure my point was silly and simplistict.

We humans have artificial lines drawn on the earth. Nature doesn't recognize those lines.... Who do we think we are? ...You go figure.... Keep this out-- Keep this in.

Australian sheep were brought into the US. A seed was also brought from those sheep- a very unpleasant seed. Now it is all over the place. Fun..NOT

Bees were brought in from Australia. Not a good thing. Now our bee population is in trouble, and we can't fix it. FIX WHAT? Not Auatralias problem.

It will never stop, life goes on. We can't control nature, but we are a part of it.

You fall dead in your back yard. No problem for a bird to land on your nose and peck at your forehead....Nature is laughing at you behind your back...The personification of animals is a fools task.

Back to feral cats..

Lived on a boat for a few years. There were feral cats around. We took a few in for pets. Great pets.

I'm talking to the Harbor Master about the cats... He said they ues to kill them.. THEN they noticed that the rat population was getting out of control. Cats back, Rats gone.

Now I have a ranch. Feral cats are around.. When they look like they are starving, I feed them...

What good are they? The most distructive animals I have here are rodents and woodpeckers. They keep that population down, GOOD!

What do they also provide? .. An afternoon snack for my bad-ass dog and food for larger preditors.

I'm not saying this is all good. I am saying that natural behavior will win and restrictions on a border will loose.

Status quo?... Not going to happen. To their credit, those critters have no pre conceived notion about life. I respect that.

Here and now is what they know... It's a good thing.

So enjoy the birds and nature and life as you know it while you can.. RJ

[Joyous]

Concerning borders. Therein lies the rub. If we are to have borders, then they should be respected. If we allow anybody and their brother to cross, then banish the borders.
Laws are laws. If we do not intend to uphold laws, then change them.

Some people have fences. Why? To keep something in or out. We have doors on our houses. We have locks on our doors. If we don't care who walks in, why lock the door?

[eye-1]

We have ferral cats because of silly PEOPLE! Like most of the problems in the World, apart from disasters of nature! We are our own worst enemies, and continue to be so!

[jiggs214]

I really got a kick last saturday while waiting for tires to be mounted on my car in automotive.

As I sat outside the front door smoking, a lady and her daughter showed up with a pasteboard box and a sign that read "KITTENS TO GIVE AWAY"

I went back to automotive to check on my vehicle and carried on a nice conversation with a couple waiting on their car for about a half an hour.

I returned to the front of the store for another smoke and watched as a 12 year old boy and his mom began to pass in front of the Kitten box, he was very interested but mom said "KEEP ON MOVING" LOL

Curious to know how many there were and how many of the kittens were left, I looked in the box and there was just one. So, I asked..how many did you have???/ 6, she said. Wow! great idea for adopting out kittens!

[robertjohnfornengo]

Ok Joy. Tell the animals to respect the boarders. Do you speak bird? RJ

[Joyous]

By ROJo
We humans have artificial lines drawn on the earth. Nature doesn't recognize those lines.... Who do we think we are? ...You go figure.... Keep this out-- Keep this in.


RJ, I was assuming you also meant we shouldn't have borders that keep people out. Am I mistaken?
Most difficult to keep animals within borders, but many creatures are transported here against their wishes and such cause problems. Those Zebra mussels (I think it's Zebra mussels) for instance which are brought here on the hull of ships and cause great problems.

[Snowden]

RJ, it's so good to see you here. Feral cats probably do a lot of damage in some places, but we do tend to make pets of them here whenever possible, don't we. And the little rascals take us in paw nicely, training us to let them have our homes and all they need to do really is purr and not claw the furniture. Even the furniture is up for grabs if they are sweet to the right slave. Uh.. owner. Former owner of the house that is!

I have heard that cats are not liked in Australia and the rats had a heyday there; I wonder if that's still the case! I know it is with Keith.

Black Bear, we have the same problems here with animals, fish and birds -- and of course the bees. I thought the killer bees were from Africa, though; I didn't know we have also been subjected to still another foreign bee. All those things being brought into the countries -- yours and ours -- cause so many problems because they have no natural enemies in the new location, I guess.

We do ok with cats here for the most part; they do catch birds, and the birds are in enough trouble because of insect sprays that kill the birds that eat the insects. Now, with the new bees and our own sweet honey bees dying by the thousand, we are faced with problems of agricultural need for those bees. That's not being taken care of by the illegals.

Wasn't, or isn't, there a brown snake in Australia that was carried to Borneo or somewhere like that? I seem to remember that it killed just about every bird in the new country; species found nowhere else on earth.

There is a fish in the waters around here that was brought in from somewhere and is killing our fish. No natural enemies here. We are indeed messing up the ecology!

[Auntie Freda]

"battle Between The Sexes "
?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????

[robertjohnfornengo]

Auntie Freda.. Sorry .

Go ahead and talk about the battle between the sexes.

Your next...... RoJo

[Joyous]

Hey Fred, one might equate some of our posts as a battle and it is between RoJo and myself. LOL

Sorry! I just have to be wicked.

[imrose]

[QUOTE=Curious to know how many there were and how many of the kittens were left, I looked in the box and there was just one. So, I asked..how many did you have???/ 6, she said. Wow! great idea for adopting out kittens![/QUOTE]

No...really bad idea! How many of those impulsive people taking a "cute" kitten will really have it spayed or neutered in order to cut down on the population of unwanted animals? Maybe 10%. Instead of giving away the kittens the owners should have had the mother & all kittens sterilized before they could contribute further to the problem. After 10 years of working in animal care/control I couldn't count the number of dogs/cats I had to put down because no one wanted them.

[robertjohnfornengo]

imrose.. So true. It makes me real sad.

My Uncle Fred found a litter of kittens. He put them in a sack and drounded them in the creek. That was one way of dealing with it.

Was he right? I don't know.

Now honestly, with all the problems in the world do you think THIS problem will ever be resolved?

Let me answer my own question.... Not on our watch.

Take care, RoJo

[Snowden]

No...really bad idea! How many of those impulsive people taking a "cute" kitten will really have it spayed or neutered in order to cut down on the population of unwanted animals? Maybe 10%. Instead of giving away the kittens the owners should have had the mother & all kittens sterilized before they could contribute further to the problem. After 10 years of working in animal care/control I couldn't count the number of dogs/cats I had to put down because no one wanted them.

I doubt if many people could pay to have an entire litter of kittens neutered, but many vets will take kittens to find homes for them, and they will not let the kitten go without neutering it first. It would also be a good idea for the person to have the mother cat spayed. They used to think it unsafe for a cat to be spayed before she had a litter, but that's no longer believed. I love kittens, but I would never have a cat that isn't neutered.

[eye-1]

I had my cat done at a young age b4 having any litters and she is over 10 now and has never had any ill effects of having been done pre any litters. She never lost her cheeky demeanor and I often wonder if she would have lost that if she had been a Mother? I love her cheekiness and I swear she has a sense of humour! I know she does! lol I think letting them have a litter first is just an "old wives tale".

[Snowden]

eye-1, I agree with you. It wouldn't have hurt my Cat (the only name that one ever had) not to have had the kittens, but I did have her spayed after she had them. And she didn't lose her cheekiness -- if that's the word for it! I'll tell you of one incident in her life that always makes me laugh.

We were driving to our house one summer day and Cat was sunning herself in the middle of the road. I called to her out of the car window to "get out of the road!" She did; got up and leisurely walked into the front yard and waited for us. I got out of the car and as I started to go into the house, she came over to me, right on my foot -- and peed on me. There is no graceful way of putting it -- that is what she did. I laughed so hard -- and hosed off my foot. I couldn't scold her, not that it would have done any good. Fortunately I was wearing old sandals and there was no damage done. She told me in no uncertain terms that she would not be yelled at!

The reason she had no name is because our middle son had been allergic to animals when he was small and when she moved in I said she had to go. She did -- 19 plus years later. For some reason, my son had no allergic reaction to her in that time and has had pets of his own since being grown with no sign of allergy. She was a perfectly beautiful little Russian Blue.

[Auntie Freda]

I love kittens, but I would never have a cat that isn't neutered.
Can we apply the same principle to "Yanks" ?
Hey presto. World Peace - in one generation.

[Joyous]

Isn't it a marvel that all the evil people live in the USA!

[Auntie Freda]

Gee, HARDLY, dear Joyous.
And I do realize that YOU realize that I was hardly being deadly serious about 'neutering' Americans ......... (ah, was I ?).

By the same token,
if you can name one single nation which has killed more civilians over the last half century, I'll be very surprised.
Hence, fewer Yanks = less carnage ?

[eye-1]

haha snowdon! Your cat took cheekiness to the extreme!Mine just gives me a clip with her paw if I dont do what I`m "told"! I get attacked at times for no apparent reason, but have had her teeth cleaned recently, and her demeanor is a lot more placid, for which I am VERY grateful! I do get my "orders" and they must be obeyed or else she will do something naughty and it IS deliberate as she watches me as she does it and is quick to move if I move an inch!Latest trick is to knock a picture off the wall above my head in bed when she deems it breakfast time..........she owns me snowden!! haha