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#362
10-28-2009, 09:12 AM
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So long as you get yours, you are OK with the projected 25 million not having coverage. 
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#363
10-29-2009, 04:00 AM
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Hey Bob,
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I'm not sure what your position on the subject is, it seems to change according to who you're responding to.
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#364
10-29-2009, 02:46 PM
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You wrote my concern as only being about money; but you didn't couple it with sustainability. I haven't read a post of yours that comes close to caring if there is a health care plan that is sustainable past our age. You will get yours from the people footing the bill. Then what? My position has been to identify the areas that are problems. Reform those then move forward with a plan that is paid for from a separate fund not associated with the general fund. Problems like fraud & waste, excessive testing to keep from being sued, covering those that have no way to cover themselves,monitoring cost vs. profit for drug R & D and sales, variations in cost of living, claim denials, doctor availability to absorb the increase in patient load. Looking at how the cash for junkers & 8k for 1st. time home buyers spiked the economy & the use of stimulus funds have not really produced long term jobs I'm pessimistic about adding to debt. What makes you optomistic that everyone will be covered,and that whatever is implemented won't wind up like what we are seeing other plan experience?
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#365
10-30-2009, 05:20 AM
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I have posted this several times but here it is again
Roll back the Reagan/Bush tax cuts for the very rich, tax cuts which have done nothing to spur the economy.
Cut military spending to a fifth of what it is today. The U.S. spends more than the rest of the world combined on the military. Those savings would go into the general fund which could then be reallocated to provide medical care. The fraud and waste you keep mentioning has been perpetuated by private PROFIT MAKING insurance companies who's main goal is to sell health insurance to only healthy people that don't require medical care.
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#366
10-30-2009, 02:51 PM
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Repeating the same thing doesn't respond to what makes you optomistic about the American economy being able to sustain more entitlements.
By repeating it really shows you have no clue and simply parrot rhetoric from some liberal web site. Quote:
I think you honestly believe what you wrote. I particularly like the selling insurance to healthy people part. That's like explaining that auto insurance is sold only to people that won't drive, or life insurance to only people that won't die.All businessess know there are risks involved and try to mimamize them. Go back to the liberal blog site where you found that 1/5th number and ask what will be left to defend America.I know you wouldn't have a clue and that the provision in the constitution about providing for common defense means nothing to liberals, I'm just curious about. Spur the economy!!!! You mean like the stimulus? THAT was intended to spur the economy and that point alone is dropping Obama's poll numbers. His popularity as a person remains high his job approval concerning the economy is where all that had HOPE are losing HOPE.
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#367
10-30-2009, 04:57 PM
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Ae you quite sure it's "all" - not 1/5th or 2/5ths ..... ? Whence did you arrive at your 100% disapproval statistic ? The same source as most of your other "facts" ? . Last edited by Cuz : 10-30-2009 at 05:01 PM.
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#368
10-31-2009, 04:37 AM
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Isn't it ironic that Obama's health care plan will cause private insurance premiums to triple,
with the biggest increases among the same young and healthy citizens who came out to vote for him in droves. ........ Last edited by *sophia* : 10-31-2009 at 08:32 AM.
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#369
10-31-2009, 05:41 AM
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Another baseless post by BobK
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Hey Bob, auto and life insurance are both choices, people don't have to drive and life insurance? Billions of people have died without it and really didn't care. Pray tell me. What did the invasion of Iraq have to do with providing for the common defense? For that matter, what did the invasion of Afghanistan have to do with the common defense? Talk about not having a clue, LOL.
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#370
10-31-2009, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bnyhan/nyhan-reifler.pdf
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#371
10-31-2009, 06:49 PM
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From the paper you provided sxyx101
DEFINING MISPERCEPTIONS To date, the study of citizens’ knowledge of politics has tended to focus on questions like veto override requirements for which answers are clearly true or false (e.g. Delli Carpini and Keeter 1996). As such, studies have typically contrasted voters who lack factual knowledge (i.e. the “ignorant”) with voters who possess it (e.g. Gilens 2001). But as Kuklinski et al. (2000) note, some voters may unknowingly hold incorrect beliefs. The paper should be read by all those that voted for Obama. The misperception that Obama would change politics, provide transparency,redistribute wealth, & provide a health care plan that wouldn't cost American's one dime in deficit spending. I think *Sophia* hit the nail on the head & explains that Obama supporters did in fact suffer misperceptions. Isn't it ironic that Obama's health care plan will cause private insurance premiums to triple,with the biggest increases among the same young and healthy citizens who came out to vote for him in droves.
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#372
10-31-2009, 09:17 PM
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Triple? Source please. You actually believe health care premiums will be $13,204+ for singles and $38,040+ for family coverage? HEALTH INSURANCE PREMIUMS In 2008, the average annual premiums for employer-sponsored health insurance are $4,704 for single coverage and $12,680 for family coverage, up about 5% from the 2007 average premiums.2 Since 1999, average premiums for family coverage have increased 119% (Exhibit A) http://ehbs.kff.org/pdf/7790.pdf
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#373
10-31-2009, 10:48 PM
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Welcome back, bebedos
 Here are some sources, as you requested, that state that Premiums could triple under Obama: Wall Street Journal (see subtitle and then read on if you wish): http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...177212064.html http://digg.com/politics/Private_ins...er_Obam aCare
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#374
10-31-2009, 11:36 PM
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http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...177212064.html
" The latest data on this score come from a series of state-level studies from the INSURANCE COMPANY WellPoint Inc. .. ....This is akin to the tobacco companies commissioning another study claiming nicotine isn't addictive and cigarettes don't cause cancer." SAYS IT ALL REALLY. The second link leads to a mere rehash of the first.
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#375
11-01-2009, 12:40 AM
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Cuz/AuntieFreda/UncleFred, WellPoint Insurance company, who runs Blue Cross plans, was just the "latest data" as requested by the Congressional delegations.
............................... Here is an exact cut and paste quote from the Wall Street Journal 10/28/09: "Private insurance premiums could triple under ObamaCare At the request of Congressional delegations...WellPoint mined its own actuarial data to model ObamaCare in the 14 states where it runs Blue Cross plans. The study therefore takes into account market and demographic differences that other industry studies have not, such as the one from the trade group America's Health Insurance Plans, which looked at aggregate national trends. In all of the 14 states WellPoint scrutinized, ObamaCare would drive up premiums for the small businesses and individuals who are most of WellPoint's customers. (Other big insurers, like Aetna, focus on the market among large businesses.) Young and healthy consumers will see the largest increases—their premiums would more than triple in some states—though average middle-class buyers will pay more too." http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...177212064.html ................................ Last edited by *sophia* : 11-01-2009 at 01:01 AM.
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#376
11-01-2009, 06:42 AM
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The whole premise of any insurance is to spread the risk among subscribers. This means that most subscribers to a plan will pay more into the plan than the services they receive cost. A minority of subscribers will receive services where the costs will exceed the amount of the premiums paid into the plan. The funds collected by an insurance company are invested until needed to pay claims. The article you’ve cited mentions the current cost of health insurance for a healthy 25 year old male. When you add a 52 year old diabetic that previously was denied health insurance to the pool, of course the premium for the 25 year old will increase. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure that out. What this so called study doesn’t address is that 52 year old diabetic receives medical care even though he doesn’t currently have an insurance policy. In my area he would go to County General where the costs of his care are paid for by the county taxpayers and higher charges for paying customers. The bottom line is that 25 year old is contributing to the health care costs of the 52 year old. The contributions made by our 25 year old aren’t in the form of higher insurance premiums; they are in the form of higher local taxes and higher hospital charges. Last edited by skxyx101 : 11-01-2009 at 07:01 AM.
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#377
11-08-2009, 06:18 AM
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The House has signed a watered down version of Health Care Reform. It probably won't help anyone very much and it's expensive.
France has the best health care system. ...... Last edited by *sophia* : 11-08-2009 at 06:26 AM.
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#381
11-10-2009, 03:59 AM
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No worries, Sophia.
I'm sure we'll all take it as Holy Writ that FRANCE has the world's best health-care system ..... because you say so. Just thought it might be interesting to know why you believe that. Cannot IMAGINE how that could end up as a Yank-bashin' exercise.
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#382
11-10-2009, 08:41 AM
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Last edited by kd1 : 11-10-2009 at 08:46 AM.
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#383
11-10-2009, 11:51 AM
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You're confused kd/calla lilly. When one goes to school they are often required to take a language. I took french for fun but that doesn't make me a citizen of France. I'd love to spend some time in southern France with Wirrel and his horses when he goes.
My knowledge of France's healthcare system comes from reading and watching a documentary on it, not experience. My knowledge of French also comes from education, not experience. And I'm not very good at it I might add. I'm a US citizen and always have been. Last edited by *sophia* : 11-10-2009 at 11:58 AM.
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#384
11-10-2009, 11:59 AM
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Those that remember when you first came here will remember you saying you were from France. Do you realize how many people here know you are Anna and laugh at you? But yet you persist in doing this to yourself. Now I am not going to respond any more to you,........in the words of Calla lilly.......Be gone with you.
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#385
11-10-2009, 12:29 PM
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You need some new material, calla lilly. I thought you said you weren't going to fight me...not sure why you said that but never-the-less here you are doing it. Are you always this hostile? LOL Did you come here to cause trouble, kd/calla lilly? Last edited by *sophia* : 11-10-2009 at 12:37 PM.
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#387
11-10-2009, 01:10 PM
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Now ..... has everyone got all that inspiring stuff off their ample chests ?
Mind if I try to drag 'Sophia' back on track ? Quote:
But what do we get ??? Quote:
How is it different to others ?
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#389
11-10-2009, 10:32 PM
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